[C320-list] New Topic - Solar Panels
David Swanson
kswanson123 at comcast.net
Tue Aug 17 18:33:45 PDT 2010
Sam,
I believe Hitachi for stock alternators, that is what mine is and Balmar for aftermarket high output alternators (this is what I may install after I try installing a Balmar 3-stage charge regulator with my stock Hitachi 60A alternator.
Dave Swanson
S/V Emily Ann
2007 C320 MK II, No. 1107
On Aug 17, 2010, at 6:03 PM, Sam Weston wrote:
> What size and brand of alternator is most common ? Mariah 585
>
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "Warren Updike" <wupdike at hotmail.com>
> Sent: Monday, August 16, 2010 5:17 PM
> To: <C320-List at Catalina320.com>
> Subject: Re: [C320-list] New Topic - Solar Panels
>
>> Pat, if you are more than a week-end cruiser consider upgrading to a high
>> output alternator and external regulator. With good batteries, battery
>> monitor, and hi o/p alt. I can go 2 days without charging. When I do charge,
>> it's much faster with the Hi o/p alt. I also have a separate starting
>> battery so starting doesn't rely on the house batteries. Oh, and paralleling
>> the two 4Ds means more total amp hours and more life for the bank.
>>
>> There are solutions on the C320 web site. If you want my project article
>> that ran in the Mainsheet, e-mail me off-list and I'll send it to you.
>>
>> Warren & Pattie Updike
>> 1994 C320 #62 "Warr de Mar"
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Pat Kenefick [mailto:pkenefick at embarqmail.com]
>> Sent: Monday, August 16, 2010 10:50 AM
>> To: c320-list at lists.catalina320.com
>> Subject: [C320-list] New Topic - Solar Panels
>>
>> I am beginning to research the use of solar panels so that I can avoid
>> having to start the engine every day when I am on the hook or moored. I
>> would like to know from those who have installed panels what size in terms
>> of wattage did you install and is there a specific brand that is recommended
>>
>> ? I have the Catalina standard refrigeration, TV, radio system, fans etc..
>> Thank you
>> Pat Kenefick
>> Cynthia Gale
>> Bath , NC
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: <c320-list-request at lists.catalina320.com>
>> To: <c320-list at lists.catalina320.com>
>> Sent: Sunday, August 15, 2010 3:00 PM
>> Subject: C320-list Digest, Vol 865, Issue 2
>>
>>
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>>>
>>> Today's Topics:
>>>
>>> 1. Re: Battery boxes (Warren Updike)
>>> 2. Re: Bird Problem (Joseph Aberdale)
>>> 3. Re: Battery boxes (djgleason1 at juno.com)
>>> 4. Equalization (Paul Rickman)
>>>
>>>
>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> Message: 1
>>> Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2010 13:29:21 -0400
>>> From: "Warren Updike" <wupdike at hotmail.com>
>>> To: <C320-List at Catalina320.com>
>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Battery boxes
>>> Message-ID: <BAY156-ds5DD1CA89C62750CCB4F89BE9A0 at phx.gbl>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>>
>>> Jeff, my understanding is that conditioning and equalization are not the
>>> same thing. Conditioning consists of imparting a low voltage at high
>>> frequency, while equalization imparts a high voltage intended to force the
>>> cells to move to a common high voltage. Equalization causes the cells to
>>> gas
>>> excessively. Conditioning can be done over a long period of time without
>>> monitoring. Equalization is a process that must be carefully monitored to
>>> avoid damaging the cells.
>>>
>>> There is a lot more to be said about both and I am curious for any other
>>> comments on either process.
>>>
>>> When I bought a new external regulator, Balmar ARS-5, it didn't have an
>>> equalization option. Balmar told me that equalization is a controversial
>>> issue and that Balmar was thinking of dropping it from future product
>>> versions. I have never performed an equalization.
>>>
>>> Warren & Pattie Updike
>>> 1994 C320 #62 "Warr de Mar"
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Jeff Hare [mailto:catalina at thehares.com]
>>> Sent: Sunday, August 15, 2010 9:45 AM
>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Battery boxes
>>>
>>> Hi John,
>>>
>>> It is unlikely that a charger would switch to the conditioning
>>> (equalization?) Mode on its own. This is something you would normally have
>>> to do intentionally since there are precautions that need to be taken
>>> before
>>> using this mode.
>>>
>>> I have lifeline 4Ds. They're great in my situation because of the long
>>> winter layup we have. I can disconnect them and ignore them all winter
>>> and
>>> they're still fully charged after 6 mos. Standard Flooded batteries
>>> wouldn't survive this without periodic charging or a solar panel.
>>>
>>> What charger do you have? The mfgr could clear up the equalization mode
>>> question for you.
>>>
>>> -Jeff
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: LOCALJG at aol.com
>>> Sender: c320-list-bounces at lists.catalina320.com
>>> Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2010 00:48:34
>>> To: <C320-List at Catalina320.com>
>>> Reply-To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Battery boxes
>>>
>>> Great info Bill! Thanks. It sounds like the Lifeline 4D AGMs are the
>>> way
>>> to go. My charging system is the three stage type so I will have to
>>> figure out a way how to get rid of the conditioning stage. I hear that
>>> you
>>> can
>>> fry an AGM if it goes through the conditioning stage of the recharge
>>> process. It looks like a little more research is in order on my part?
>>>
>>> John #329
>>>
>>>
>>> In a message dated 8/14/2010 3:58:30 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
>>> billculb_a2 at yahoo.com writes:
>>>
>>> John,
>>> Rolls are pretty much the Rolls-Royce of lead-acid batteries. For AGMs I
>>> feel
>>> that Lifeline's are the Rolls-Royce. I replaced my original Exide Gold's
>>> with 2
>>> LifeLine 4D's 2 years ago after getting a whopping 7 years out of the
>>> Exide's.
>>> The Lifeline's are expensive but projected to give lots of years and I'm
>>> sold on
>>> the advantages of AGMs. Also they are rated @ 210Ah and I had lots of
>>> trouble
>>> finding any 4Ds over 180Ah.
>>> http://www.lifelinebatteries.com/marinedeepcycle.php
>>>
>>> -bill
>>> Harmony #859
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ________________________________
>>> From: "LOCALJG at aol.com" <LOCALJG at aol.com>
>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>> Sent: Sat, August 14, 2010 3:30:03 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Battery boxes
>>>
>>> Hi Larry: Thanks for the info. My boat is paid for so this isn't an
>>> insurance issue. I was just curious. I like doing things correctly and
>>> just
>>> couldn't understand why Catalina would not be doing "the right thing"
>>> when
>>> it
>>> came to battery boxes. Apparently Catalina is doing the right thing.
>>>
>>> Which reminds me; thank you to all the people who provided me with the
>>> wealth of information that has been sent. Whatever they are paying you
>>> guys, it
>>>
>>> isn't enough.
>>>
>>> Larry, you mentioned two other types of batteries; AGMs and Gells. I was
>>> under the understanding that the Rolls 4D was, well, the Rolls Royce of
>>> batteries? For a cruising C320, do you believe another battery would
>>> provide
>>> the
>>>
>>> requisite energy and still provide such a long life as the 4D? The 4Ds I
>>> am about to replace have been in service for over 10 years and are only
>>> now
>>> beginning to have issues.
>>>
>>> One thing I can say about not having a battery sealed in a battery box is
>>> that there has been some acid leakage down the battery and onto the
>>> fiberglass. The fiberglass has been discolored but still holds strong.
>>>
>>> Does anyone else have this acid on fiberglass issue?
>>>
>>> John # 329
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> Message: 2
>>> Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2010 13:41:57 -0400
>>> From: Joseph Aberdale <summerwind3 at comcast.net>
>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Bird Problem
>>> Message-ID: <FB79DFA6-F01D-4498-8378-C4CE60CDEE07 at comcast.net>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed
>>>
>>> Do they use monofilament and how do they mount it to the mast and
>>> shroud? I have an in mast furling mainsail so I would be reluctant
>>> to put screws into the mast. Thanks.
>>>
>>> On Aug 14, 2010, at 8:15 PM, David J Cardoza wrote:
>>>
>>>> Not sure where you're from but almost everyone where we keep our
>>>> boat on
>>>> Buzzards Bay on Cape Cod has trip lines wired across about 3 to 5
>>>> inches
>>>> above our spreaders. It's very effective.
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: c320-list-bounces at lists.catalina320.com
>>>> [mailto:c320-list-bounces at lists.catalina320.com] On Behalf Of MICHAEL
>>>> COLE
>>>> Sent: Saturday, August 14, 2010 12:17 AM
>>>> To: Catalina320
>>>> Subject: [C320-list] Bird Problem
>>>>
>>>> Joe I don't know whether your gulls are more agressive than the
>>>> ones we
>>>> have in Sydney but I bought a plastic owl and slung it up on the
>>>> spinnaker topping lift so that it hangs midway between the mast and
>>>> the
>>>> pulpit--it seems to work OK. There is another 320 moored out a
>>>> couple of
>>>> hundred yards away with the same type of owl sitting on pushpit rail
>>>> together with old CDs strung on lines from bow to stern
>>>> Mike Cole #421 Mio Dio
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> Message: 3
>>> Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2010 13:45:45 -0400
>>> From: djgleason1 at juno.com
>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>> Cc: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Battery boxes
>>> Message-ID: <20100815.104645.48.229285 at mailpop06.dca.untd.com>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>>>
>>> Bob:
>>>
>>> In response to your question regarding the breaker panel on the port side
>>> is: The original placement of the 4 D batteries was one on the port
>>> side just forward of the nav table. The other was placed on the
>>> starboard side. On hull #150, the previous owner moved the port battery
>>> to the starboard side. I do not know when Catalina made the change to
>>> both on the starboard side.
>>>
>>> Dave Gleason, #150
>>> Proud Mary
>>>
>>> On Fri, 13 Aug 2010 21:01:40 -0400 Robert Seastream
>>> <robert.seastream at comcast.net> writes:
>>>> This raises another question. Why did Catalina put the breaker panel
>>>>
>>>> to port (at least on my model), rather than starboard where the
>>>> batteries are?
>>>> I'd think placing the breaker panel to starboard would have reduced
>>>>
>>>> some cable runs and their inherent voltage drop.
>>>>
>>>> Bob Seastream
>>>> Intuition # 906
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Aug 13, 2010, at 7:14 PM, Jeff Hare wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > Hi,
>>>> >
>>>> > I can't say whose right. *I* believe Catalina however. With well
>>>>
>>>> > over 1000 hulls built and shipped all over the world this way,
>>>> it's
>>>> > a non-issue for the intended use of the boat in my opinion.
>>>> >
>>>> > Given that the batteries are in a well protected area and securely
>>>>
>>>> > held down, sit in a spill tray, there's little to be gained by a
>>>>
>>>> > battery box. One wouldn't fit anyway without downsizing the
>>>> batteries.
>>>> >
>>>> > The real danger of flooded batteries I've heard is the chance of
>>>>
>>>> > seawater contacting battery acid. A box won't likely solve that
>>>> > since they MUST be we'll vented.
>>>> >
>>>> > If using the boat for serious offshore use you'd use AGMs anyway
>>>> for
>>>> > maximum safety.
>>>> > Just keep the 4Ds we'll secured and enjoy the boat.
>>>> >
>>>> > -Jeff
>>>> > -----Original Message-----
>>>> > From: LOCALJG at aol.com
>>>> > Sender: c320-list-bounces at lists.catalina320.com
>>>> > Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2010 17:58:15
>>>> > To: <C320-List at Catalina320.com>
>>>> > Reply-To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>>> > Subject: [C320-list] Battery boxes
>>>> >
>>>> > In April I bought a beautiful Catalina 320. During the survey,
>>>> the
>>>> > surveyor noted that the Catalina's three batteries were not in
>>>> > battery boxes. The
>>>> > broker said that Catalina has a waiver for the 320 and the boats
>>>> come
>>>> > without battery boxes from the factory. The surveyor had never
>>>> > heard this and
>>>> > didn't believe it. The surveyor believed that the Coast Guard
>>>> would
>>>> > have a
>>>> > serious problem with a boat that had its batteries that were not in
>>>>
>>>> > battery
>>>> > boxes.
>>>> >
>>>> > So, who's correct?
>>>> >
>>>> > Due to the age of the batteries, it is time for me to replace all
>>>>
>>>> > three
>>>> > batteries and this would be a great time to place the batteries in
>>>>
>>>> > boxes if it
>>>> > is truly required by the Coast Guard. Just for the sake of safety,
>>>> I
>>>> > believe
>>>> > I should place the batteries in boxes but I am curious as to the
>>>>
>>>> > broker's
>>>> > veracity on this subject.
>>>> >
>>>> > Is there anyone out there who can state categorically and without
>>>> a
>>>> > doubt
>>>> > who is correct, the surveyor or the broker?
>>>> >
>>>> > If the Battery boxes are truly required, It appears I will be
>>>> somewhat
>>>> > challenged due to the space available to me. The group 27,
>>>> starting
>>>> > battery is
>>>> > up in the front of the starboard settee and just behind it is the
>>>>
>>>> > first of
>>>> > two Rolls, 4Ds. The second 4D is in the compartment just behind
>>>> the
>>>> > other
>>>> > two batteries. I think the problem is going to be getting the
>>>> group
>>>> > 27
>>>> > battery in a box due to its location at the front of the settee.
>>>> >
>>>> > So, how do the rest of you 320 battery box people do it?
>>>> >
>>>> > Thanks for any input you care to share.
>>>> >
>>>> > John. #329
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> ____________________________________________________________
>>> Project Management Cert
>>> Villanova PMP® & CAPM® Classes. Average Salary For PMPs is $100K
>>> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3141/4c68281da6e846e5ea1st05duc
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> Message: 4
>>> Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2010 11:14:01 -0700 (PDT)
>>> From: Paul Rickman <ilove2sail at verizon.net>
>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>> Subject: [C320-list] Equalization
>>> Message-ID: <910593.70958.qm at web84306.mail.re1.yahoo.com>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>>>
>>> Here is one opion:
>>>
>>> http://shop.pkys.com/battery-equalization.aspx
>>>
>>> There are others that can be searched out.
>>>
>>> The Xantrex True Charge 20 has an equalizer but
>>> it must be manually turned on. It can be turned off
>>> by simply cutting the power to the unit.
>>>
>>> Paul
>>> Affinity 657
>>> Bay Bridge Marina
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ________________________________
>>> From: Warren Updike <wupdike at hotmail.com>
>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>> Sent: Sun, August 15, 2010 4:29:21 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Battery boxes
>>>
>>> Jeff, my understanding is that conditioning and equalization are not the
>>> same thing. Conditioning consists of imparting a low voltage at high
>>> frequency, while equalization imparts a high voltage intended to force the
>>> cells to move to a common high voltage. Equalization causes the cells to
>>> gas
>>> excessively.? Conditioning can be done over a long period of time without
>>> monitoring.? Equalization is a process that must be carefully monitored to
>>> avoid damaging the cells.?
>>>
>>> There is a lot more to be said about both and I am curious for any other
>>> comments on either process.
>>>
>>> When I bought a new external regulator, Balmar ARS-5, it didn't have an
>>> equalization option. Balmar told me that equalization is a controversial
>>> issue and that Balmar was thinking of dropping it from future product
>>> versions.? I have never performed an equalization.
>>>
>>> Warren & Pattie Updike
>>> 1994 C320 #62 "Warr de Mar"
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Jeff Hare [mailto:catalina at thehares.com]
>>> Sent: Sunday, August 15, 2010 9:45 AM
>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Battery boxes
>>>
>>> Hi John,
>>>
>>> It is unlikely that a charger would switch to the conditioning
>>> (equalization?) Mode on its own. This is something you would normally have
>>> to do intentionally since there are precautions that need to be taken
>>> before
>>> using this mode.
>>>
>>> I have lifeline 4Ds.? They're great in my situation because of the long
>>> winter layup we have.? I can disconnect them and ignore them all winter
>>> and
>>> they're still fully charged after 6 mos.? Standard Flooded batteries
>>> wouldn't survive this without periodic charging or a solar panel.
>>>
>>> What charger do you have?? The mfgr could clear up the equalization mode
>>> question for you.
>>>
>>> -Jeff
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: LOCALJG at aol.com
>>> Sender: c320-list-bounces at lists.catalina320.com
>>> Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2010 00:48:34
>>> To: <C320-List at Catalina320.com>
>>> Reply-To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Battery boxes
>>>
>>> Great info Bill!? Thanks.? It sounds like the Lifeline 4D AGMs? are the
>>> way
>>> to go.? My charging system is the three stage type so I? will have to
>>> figure out a way how to get rid of the conditioning stage.? I? hear that
>>> you
>>> can
>>> fry an AGM if it goes through the conditioning stage of? the recharge
>>> process.? It looks like a little more research is in? order on my part??
>>>
>>> John? #329
>>>
>>>
>>> In a message dated 8/14/2010 3:58:30 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,?
>>> billculb_a2 at yahoo.com writes:
>>>
>>> John,
>>> Rolls are pretty much the Rolls-Royce of lead-acid? batteries.? For AGMs I
>>> feel
>>> that Lifeline's are the? Rolls-Royce.? I replaced my original Exide Gold's
>>> with 2
>>> LifeLine? 4D's 2 years ago after getting a whopping 7 years out of the
>>> Exide's.
>>> The? Lifeline's are expensive but projected to give lots of years and I'm
>>> sold on?
>>> the advantages of AGMs.? Also they are rated @ 210Ah and I had lots? of
>>> trouble
>>> finding any 4Ds over 180Ah.
>>> http://www.lifelinebatteries.com/marinedeepcycle.php
>>>
>>> -bill
>>> Harmony? #859
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ________________________________
>>> From:? "LOCALJG at aol.com" <LOCALJG at aol.com>
>>> To:? C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>> Sent: Sat, August 14, 2010 3:30:03 PM
>>> Subject:? Re: [C320-list] Battery boxes
>>>
>>> Hi Larry:? Thanks for the? info.? My boat is paid for so this isn't an
>>> insurance issue.? I? was just curious.? I like doing things correctly and
>>> just
>>> couldn't? understand why Catalina would not be doing "the right thing"
>>> when
>>> it
>>> came? to battery boxes.? Apparently Catalina is doing the right thing.?
>>>
>>> Which reminds me; thank you to all the people who provided me with the?
>>> wealth of information that has been sent.? Whatever they are paying? you
>>> guys, it
>>>
>>> isn't enough.?
>>>
>>> Larry, you mentioned two? other types of batteries; AGMs and Gells.? I was
>>> under the? understanding that the Rolls 4D was, well, the Rolls Royce of?
>>> batteries?? For a cruising C320, do you believe another battery would?
>>> provide
>>> the
>>>
>>> requisite energy and still provide such a long life as? the 4D?? The 4Ds I
>>> am about to replace have been in service for over? 10 years and are only
>>> now
>>> beginning to have issues.?
>>>
>>> One? thing I can say about not having a battery sealed in a battery box is
>>> that? there has been some acid leakage down the battery and onto the?
>>> fiberglass.? The fiberglass has been discolored but still holds? strong.?
>>>
>>> Does anyone else have this acid on fiberglass? issue??
>>>
>>> John #? 329
>>>
>>> End of C320-list Digest, Vol 865, Issue 2
>>> *****************************************
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>>
>> No virus found in this incoming message.
>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
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David Swanson
kswanson123 at comcast.net
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