[C320-list] C320-list Digest, Vol 882, Issue 1
Jack McDonough
mcdonough5 at verizon.net
Wed Sep 8 09:05:35 PDT 2010
Duly noted. Into the file it goes.
Oddly enough, one of those drawers in the quarterberth fell out on its own a
couple of weeks ago. I could find only two screws, both about one-half inch
long -- and reattached the unit with longer screws.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chris Burti" <clburti at gmail.com>
To: <C320-List at catalina320.com>
Sent: Wednesday, September 08, 2010 10:44 AM
Subject: Re: [C320-list] C320-list Digest, Vol 882, Issue 1
> Couple of updates for your list...
>
> Peggy says the vent filter is a definite "do not do" as it make the
> problem worse by restricting the vent. Our vent lines are adequately
> sized but then they are restricted by an adapter hose at the through
> hull vent which is undersized for the line. A vent filter would
> exacerbate the restriction.
>
> The biggest reason the smell permeates less expensive hoses is that
> people either want to save space in the holding tank or simply don't
> realize how many strokes it take to flush the line completely and thus
> thye let the waste soak in the discharge line. After a while it
> permeates through the cheaper hose material. You need at least seven
> or eight wet bowl strokes to flush and as many dry bowl strokes to
> evacuate the line.
>
> When working on the intake side, you can remove the drawer unit in the
> aft cabin by taking out about four screws and have easy access to work
> comfortably in the area under the head sink. Agree with you on the big
> discharge hoses which together with the fact that they don't stink yet
> is is why that project will wait on Commitment until I replace the
> head.
>
>
>
> On Wed, Sep 8, 2010 at 10:07 AM, Jack McDonough <mcdonough5 at verizon.net>
> wrote:
>> Chris:
>>
>> Many points well taken.
>>
>> I am familiar with Peggy Hall (The Head Mistress) and over the years, on
>> other boats, we have tried any number of suggestions to improve the head
>> situation. We do not put bleach or anything else in the tank that would
>> discourage the bacteria. And I do understand that the head system on a
>> boat
>> is not to be compared with a toilet in the house.
>>
>> I'm not familiar with Trident or Shield hoses but may have to learn about
>> them if that is a solution -- or at least part of a solution. But,
>> frankly,
>> the prospect of wrestling with those large, thick, stiff hoses in those
>> small spaces is unappealing. Ditto for the intake hoses which, although
>> they
>> appear far more flexible, require lying in some uncomfortable, nearly
>> impossible position to access the intake end in a cramped space that
>> provides almost no opportunity for leverage. (I tackled many DIY projects
>> in
>> my house but marine hoses, fittings and cramped spaces are something else
>> entirely.)
>>
>> Many pieces of advice conflict, by the way. For instance, some swear by
>> the
>> effectiveness of putting a filter in the vent hose. Others say it doesn't
>> work. It's a moot point for me anyway because there's no room for a
>> filter
>> unless, possibly, I remove the cabinet in the head and put a filter where
>> the line comes up there -- if there's room even there. And I'm reluctant
>> to
>> go through that exercise if the chance for success is only fifty-fifty. I
>> assume, by the way, that I'd have to remove that cabinet to do anything
>> at
>> all about the vent hose.
>>
>> In summary, then, some solutions appear to require extensive labor that
>> I'm
>> not convinced that I'm capable of doing -- despite years of plumbing,
>> wiring
>> and carpentry around the house. In addition, many 320 owners seem to
>> relish
>> tackling "projects" in the offseason. Our long offseason is cold and
>> snowy,
>> and the boat is about a 50-mile rountrip from home. None of those factors
>> translate to "Oh, boy, a winter project."
>>
>> But thanks for the tutorial, which I'm printing for my "boat" file.
>>
>> Jack
>> #947
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Burti" <clburti at gmail.com>
>> To: <C320-List at catalina320.com>
>> Sent: Tuesday, September 07, 2010 11:52 PM
>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] C320-list Digest, Vol 882, Issue 1
>>
>>
>> Jack,
>>
>>
>> It would have been nice if Catalina had installed an optimally sized
>> and unrestricted vent in our boats and had used Trident 101/102 for
>> toilet and tank discharge lines and Shields or Trident #148 for line
>> sizes smaller than 1". It would have been really nice if they had
>> installed Raritan PH II heads instead of the cheesy Jabsco units. But,
>> what we have is more than minimally functional and works fine as long
>> as you maintain your system properly and regularly.
>>
>> You simply don't have to go to any great lengths in order to have an
>> odor free system. There are improvements that can be made to any
>> factory system...that doesn't mean you are required to make them in
>> order for the system on a C-320 to be odor free . Some owners do not
>> seem to realize that a marine sanitation system is not like a bathroom
>> at home...flush it and forget it...all of them require a certain
>> amount of special care and as a result some of their boats are going
>> to smell. If it sounds like I am suggesting that some of these
>> complaints may be attributed to operator error, maybe I am, but if I
>> am, it comes from reading extensivelwhat the experts are saying on the
>> subject and applying that advice in practice.
>>
>> I have installed a complete marine sanitation system from scratch on
>> an older boat following their advice and it worked flawlessly and odor
>> free. We have a 2001 model C-320 and the system is all original
>> (except for the cheesy Jabsco head which was cheaper to replace than
>> rebuild the pump and which will be replaced with a Raritan head next
>> time along with new Trident hoses), we maintain the system according
>> to their advice and our boat has been odor free for the seven years we
>> have owned it. We keep clothing the hanging lockers and folded in the
>> drawers year around so we can spend a couple of nights any time on the
>> boat on a moments impulse and they do not even smell musty.
>>
>> I flush straight out of the Pamlico River and those on list from this
>> area will let you know it is anything but fresh and unsullied. I do
>> make certain to flush enough to keep waste from sitting in the hoses.
>> The Admiral prefers to use a jug of fresh water. I do flush the
>> holding tank with fresh water when I pump it out, I do flush the vent
>> line with a hose and make sure wasps and spiders haven't plugged the
>> screen. I do remove the intake hose and clean it thoroughly a couple
>> of times a year. I do not pour bleach, sanitizers or odor removers
>> into the head, I do not use harsh chemicals that kill the good
>> bacteria in the holding tank when I clean the head.
>>
>> If you want to get a good handle on how to maintain and even improve
>> your system, go online to places such as the Cruisers Forum or
>> SaiboatOwner's.com forums and read Peggy Hall's postings on the
>> subject of marine sanitation. She is widely regarded as the expert in
>> the field and generous with her knowledge
>>
>> On the numbers, there are no more C-320 complaints voiced in this
>> thread than on any other boating forum thread touching on the subject
>> regardless of builder or model. It is a very common boating topic.
>> Unfortunatly, we don't have Peggy Hall here on our C-320 IA list to
>> set us straight.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Sep 7, 2010 at 6:02 PM, Jack McDonough <mcdonough5 at verizon.net>
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I don't understand the "less than one percent of the hull (sic)
>>> reporting."
>>>
>>> The great majority of those commenting on the odor problem obviously
>>> have
>>> the problem. So, that's more than one percent. Is it one percent of all
>>> the
>>> 320s ever sold? Who knows? I'm sure no one has polled them all. And if
>>> they
>>> did, I'll bet the percentage having the problem is well up in the double
>>> digits.
>>>
>>> The 320 is a great boat. No argument.
>>>
>>> But when owners have to go to such great lengths as installing separate
>>> water tanks for flushing, replacing all head hoses, removing and
>>> treating
>>> the inside and outside of holding tanks, refraining from putting solids
>>> in
>>> the head, deciding not to use their hanging lockers because of the
>>> odor --
>>> then there are some real problems here. The answer is not to say, "Gee,
>>> mine is OK. I guess it's your tough luck."
>>>
>>> I think this problem is systemic. And I think Catalina should look into
>>> it.
>>> But that's just me.
>>>
>>> Jack
>>> #947
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Burti" <clburti at gmail.com>
>>> To: <C320-List at catalina320.com>
>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 01, 2010 4:52 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] C320-list Digest, Vol 882, Issue 1
>>>
>>>
>>> Not doubting the problem for those who have it, but it is is less than
>>> one percent of the hull reporting...that is hardly universal.
>>>
>>> I don't even use fresh water except to flush the holding tank and have
>>> no problem with oder once we purge the intake. I have a good sense of
>>> smell and the Admiral will not tolerate any off oders, so it is not an
>>> issue of heper sensitivity.
>>>
>>> On a prior boat we had a problem with a leakin clamp that allow the
>>> stench to permeat the glass and wood in th elockers where the hoses
>>> were routed. I diluted chlorine bleach with water in a garden sprayer
>>> and sprayed the offending lockers, closed up the boat and went home.
>>> Next trip all was well.
>>>
>>> On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 3:43 PM, michael nagelkirk
>>> <mikenagelkirk at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> My goodness Sean, Fred and all the rest of us dealing with the odor
>>>> issue.
>>>> I
>>>> had no idea that it was almost universal. To think of the time and
>>>> money
>>>> required just to get as little as 20% of the odor out and not even be
>>>> able
>>>> to use your locker or the full potential of your head for that matter
>>>> is
>>>> appalling. I think we should collectively take this up with Catalina
>>>> directly and have its experts solve the problem and possibly even
>>>> contribute
>>>> to the remedy.
>>>>
>>>> *Mike NagelkirkMikeNagelkirk*
>>>> True North #909
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 3:00 PM,
>>>> <c320-list-request at lists.catalina320.com>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Send C320-list mailing list submissions to
>>>>> c320-list at lists.catalina320.com
>>>>>
>>>>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>>>>> http://lists.catalina320.com/listinfo.cgi/c320-list-catalina320.com
>>>>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>>>>> c320-list-request at lists.catalina320.com
>>>>>
>>>>> You can reach the person managing the list at
>>>>> c320-list-owner at lists.catalina320.com
>>>>>
>>>>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>>>>> than "Re: Contents of C320-list digest..."
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Today's Topics:
>>>>>
>>>>> 1. Re: eliminating odor (Sean Kaldor)
>>>>> 2. Re: eliminating odor (Fred LEcuyer)
>>>>> 3. Cockpit shower wand (Irving Grunes)
>>>>> 4. muffler and electrical excitment (pat reynolds)
>>>>> 5. Re: Cockpit shower wand (hcreech at comcast.net)
>>>>> 6. Re: Cockpit shower wand (Irving Grunes)
>>>>> 7. Re: Cockpit shower wand (hcreech at comcast.net)
>>>>> 8. Re: Cockpit shower wand (Scott Thompson)
>>>>> 9. Hurricane Earl (Robert Seastream)
>>>>> 10. Re: Hurricane Earl (ericstillwellevans at gmail.com)
>>>>> 11. Re: Hurricane Earl (jim brown)
>>>>> 12. Re: Hurricane Earl (=?utf-8?B?YXJnYXRlczJuZEBjb21jYXN0Lm5ldA==?=)
>>>>> 13. Re: Hurricane Earl (Kurt Budelmann)
>>>>> 14. Re: Hurricane Earl (Jeff Hare)
>>>>> 15. Re: muffler and electrical excitment (chester carson)
>>>>> 16. Re: muffler and electrical excitment (pat reynolds)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> Message: 1
>>>>> Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2010 12:20:11 -0700 (PDT)
>>>>> From: Sean Kaldor <spkaldor at yahoo.com>
>>>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] eliminating odor
>>>>> Message-ID: <697913.24018.qm at web50204.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>>>>>
>>>>> We've also had a problem with odor on our 1998 #499.
>>>>>
>>>>> Prior Owner used rarely. Noticed the smell in the locker and in the
>>>>> compartment
>>>>> under the sink upon purchase.
>>>>>
>>>>> Took the following action:
>>>>>
>>>>> (1) Replaced the entire head;
>>>>> (2) Replaced all hoses to/from the head (raw water intake, pumpout) as
>>>>> well
>>>>> as
>>>>> sink drain hose;
>>>>> (3) Replaced the main vent hose;
>>>>> (4) Replaced the hose from the head to the holding tank;
>>>>> (5) Removed all wood from the locker, sprayed locker and
>>>>> compartment?repeatedly
>>>>> with pet odor 'natures miracle' remover;
>>>>> (6) Cleaned entire head compartment with bleach/water;
>>>>> (7) Have used fresh water flush since we purchased the boat, and no
>>>>> solid
>>>>> waste;
>>>>> (8) Cleaned the thru-hull vent;
>>>>>
>>>>> Four?months later, I would say the odor is about 20% improved.
>>>>>
>>>>> The only other steps I can think of would be:
>>>>> (1) Replace the holding tank;
>>>>> (2) Replace hoses to macerator, and the macerator;
>>>>> (3) Scrub area under the holding tank with bleach/water and odor
>>>>> remover;
>>>>>
>>>>> But I have no idea if that will really fix the problem. At this point,
>>>>> we
>>>>> don't
>>>>> store anything in the locker and are happy the smell doesn't go any
>>>>> further
>>>>> than
>>>>> that.
>>>>>
>>>>> Sean
>>>>> Libert? #499
>>>>> San Francisco
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> Message: 2
>>>>> Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2010 15:35:34 -0400
>>>>> From: Fred LEcuyer <fred.lecuyer at live.com>
>>>>> To: Catalina320list Catalina320list <c320-list at catalina320.com>
>>>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] eliminating odor
>>>>> Message-ID: <SNT113-W37399B1320F4AABC876DDE98A0 at phx.gbl>
>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Sean:
>>>>>
>>>>> Our biggest improvement seemed to come when I re-tefloned the fittings
>>>>> to
>>>>> the tank and removed the tank to scrub underneath.
>>>>>
>>>>> Someone further down the E-mail chain suggest that backpressure from
>>>>> accidently hitting the macerator switch may have caused leakage at the
>>>>> fittings. That makes sense to me and it's nearly impossible to tell
>>>>> what's
>>>>> under the tank until you pull it.
>>>>>
>>>>> Fred
>>>>>
>>>>> > Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2010 12:20:11 -0700
>>>>> > From: spkaldor at yahoo.com
>>>>> > To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>>>> > Subject: Re: [C320-list] eliminating odor
>>>>> >
>>>>> > We've also had a problem with odor on our 1998 #499.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Prior Owner used rarely. Noticed the smell in the locker and in the
>>>>> compartment
>>>>> > under the sink upon purchase.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Took the following action:
>>>>> >
>>>>> > (1) Replaced the entire head;
>>>>> > (2) Replaced all hoses to/from the head (raw water intake, pumpout)
>>>>> > as
>>>>> well as
>>>>> > sink drain hose;
>>>>> > (3) Replaced the main vent hose;
>>>>> > (4) Replaced the hose from the head to the holding tank;
>>>>> > (5) Removed all wood from the locker, sprayed locker and compartment
>>>>> repeatedly
>>>>> > with pet odor 'natures miracle' remover;
>>>>> > (6) Cleaned entire head compartment with bleach/water;
>>>>> > (7) Have used fresh water flush since we purchased the boat, and no
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > solid
>>>>> waste;
>>>>> > (8) Cleaned the thru-hull vent;
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Four months later, I would say the odor is about 20% improved.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > The only other steps I can think of would be:
>>>>> > (1) Replace the holding tank;
>>>>> > (2) Replace hoses to macerator, and the macerator;
>>>>> > (3) Scrub area under the holding tank with bleach/water and odor >
>>>>> > remover;
>>>>> >
>>>>> > But I have no idea if that will really fix the problem. At this
>>>>> > point,
>>>>> > > we
>>>>> don't
>>>>> > store anything in the locker and are happy the smell doesn't go any
>>>>> further than
>>>>> > that.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Sean
>>>>> > Libert? #499
>>>>> > San Francisco
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> Message: 3
>>>>> Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2010 18:00:00 -0400
>>>>> From: Irving Grunes <igrunes at gmail.com>
>>>>> To: C320-List <C320-list at catalina320.org>
>>>>> Subject: [C320-list] Cockpit shower wand
>>>>> Message-ID:
>>>>> <AANLkTimr4vwxdBEF6CBXT1omhq6ftVM0Wn9GQGGNRjt- at mail.gmail.com>
>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>>>>>
>>>>> Where to buy replacement shower wand and hose
>>>>> Irv grunes
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> Message: 4
>>>>> Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2010 17:10:55 -0700 (PDT)
>>>>> From: pat reynolds <lorasalum at yahoo.com>
>>>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>>>> Subject: [C320-list] muffler and electrical excitment
>>>>> Message-ID: <268590.93779.qm at web36503.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>>>>>
>>>>> As a religious follower of the wisdom imparted on this site since its'
>>>>> inception, I have been fortunate to have avoided many of the problems
>>>>> cited,
>>>>> ie; head odors (freshwater boat), charger problems, corrosion etc. In
>>>>> the
>>>>> 15 years we have owned the boat I have only had the muffler and the
>>>>> electrical fuel pump replaced. ( I know, I just opened pandora's box).
>>>>> I
>>>>> do
>>>>> have a water under the liner problem which I have been meaning to
>>>>> address
>>>>> for several of those 15 years (again freshwater only). I think
>>>>> fortunately
>>>>> however that that problem may have saved the boat.
>>>>>
>>>>> On a recent single handed return from a long distance race on Lake
>>>>> Michigan
>>>>> (blessed freshwater) I was awaken at anchor at 3 am by the bilge pump
>>>>> cycling. It seems that the year old replacement muffler I had gotten
>>>>> from
>>>>> Catalina had developed two leaks in the bottom (worse than the 14 year
>>>>> old
>>>>> one I replaced) and motoring that day had filled the bilges and
>>>>> assorted
>>>>> pockets. Tired and grumbling since I was still 100 miles from home, I
>>>>> removed the floor boards and hand pumped for a couple of hours. Some
>>>>> of
>>>>> the
>>>>> water remained, as always, under the liner.
>>>>>
>>>>> I had the muffler reglassed at the next port and continued on. Two
>>>>> nights
>>>>> later while in a slip, again at 4 am during a bad electrical storm, I
>>>>> smelled something burning. I had a fan running off the shore power and
>>>>> thought it had overheated but it was cool. I turned on the cabin
>>>>> lights
>>>>> which run off the batteries and noticed a faint wisp of smoke coming
>>>>> from
>>>>> behind the electrical panel. It was heavier when I opened the panel.
>>>>> Opening the battery compartment I could see that the charger wire
>>>>> insulation had burned completely off and these wires had fused onto
>>>>> and
>>>>> burned the battery cables. These wires run under the liner through
>>>>> conduit
>>>>> from the starboard to the port side. Apparently a power surge at the
>>>>> marina
>>>>> had come in thru the shore power cord, burned out the charger and
>>>>> started
>>>>> the electrical fire. When they pulled the wiring and conduit out I
>>>>> could
>>>>> see that the conduit (pvc pipe) was burned completely thru under the
>>>>> liner.
>>>>> I am thinking
>>>>> that maybe the water underneath had helped keep the fire from
>>>>> spreading.
>>>>> Except for all of the wiring, charger and battery switch all else was
>>>>> ok.
>>>>>
>>>>> The electrician did not reconnect the charger wires directly to the
>>>>> battery, but to the battery switch with fuses. He said that would
>>>>> alleviate
>>>>> some of the wiring running underneath the liner. He also said that the
>>>>> reason that the charger breaker did not pop was because the charge
>>>>> went
>>>>> thru
>>>>> the negative side seeking ground.
>>>>>
>>>>> This was just a long way of saying that we should be aware of the
>>>>> wiring
>>>>> which is run thru and under the liner from the engine, charger, panel
>>>>> etc.
>>>>> In additon to being inaccessible it may also be subject to chafe and
>>>>> fraying. If I am ever on the boat again during an electrical storm I
>>>>> will
>>>>> immediately remove the shore power cord.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> Message: 5
>>>>> Date: Wed, 1 Sep 2010 00:43:47 +0000 (UTC)
>>>>> From: hcreech at comcast.net
>>>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Cockpit shower wand
>>>>> Message-ID:
>>>>> <
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 1793164456.820936.1283301827848.JavaMail.root at sz0074a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net
>>>>> >
>>>>>
>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>>>>>
>>>>> Real easy, Home Depot or Lowes, it's a standard replacement item. That
>>>>> is
>>>>> where I bought mine.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Herb Creech
>>>>> Cloud Chaser #606
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Irving Grunes" <igrunes at gmail.com>
>>>>> To: "C320-List" <C320-list at catalina320.org>
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, August 31, 2010 6:00:00 PM
>>>>> Subject: [C320-list] Cockpit shower wand
>>>>>
>>>>> Where to buy replacement shower wand and hose
>>>>> Irv grunes
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> Message: 6
>>>>> Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2010 20:49:07 -0400
>>>>> From: Irving Grunes <igrunes at gmail.com>
>>>>> To: C320-List at catalina320.com
>>>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Cockpit shower wand
>>>>> Message-ID:
>>>>> <AANLkTikz4Ju1H9wbYo_YRyW7nXMHHVxa0LysYLmnj73w at mail.gmail.com>
>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>>>>>
>>>>> Sorry, I meant cockpit shower wand.
>>>>> Irv
>>>>> #851
>>>>>
>>>>> On Aug 31, 2010 8:43 PM, <hcreech at comcast.net> wrote:
>>>>> Real easy, Home Depot or Lowes, it's a standard replacement item. That
>>>>> is
>>>>> where I bought mine.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Herb Creech
>>>>> Cloud Chaser #606
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Irving Grunes" <igrunes at gmail.com>
>>>>> To: "C320-List" <C320-li...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> Message: 7
>>>>> Date: Wed, 1 Sep 2010 01:55:14 +0000 (UTC)
>>>>> From: hcreech at comcast.net
>>>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Cockpit shower wand
>>>>> Message-ID:
>>>>> <
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 405149512.824953.1283306114833.JavaMail.root at sz0074a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net
>>>>> >
>>>>>
>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>>>>>
>>>>> That was what I was talking about, read it right the first time.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Herb
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Irving Grunes" <igrunes at gmail.com>
>>>>> To: C320-List at catalina320.com
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, August 31, 2010 8:49:07 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Cockpit shower wand
>>>>>
>>>>> Sorry, I meant cockpit shower wand.
>>>>> Irv
>>>>> #851
>>>>>
>>>>> On Aug 31, 2010 8:43 PM, <hcreech at comcast.net> wrote:
>>>>> Real easy, Home Depot or Lowes, it's a standard replacement item. That
>>>>> is
>>>>> where I bought mine.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Herb Creech
>>>>> Cloud Chaser #606
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Irving Grunes" <igrunes at gmail.com>
>>>>> To: "C320-List" <C320-li...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> Message: 8
>>>>> Date: Wed, 01 Sep 2010 07:29:26 -0400
>>>>> From: Scott Thompson <surprise at thompson87.com>
>>>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Cockpit shower wand
>>>>> Message-ID: <4C7E3916.8040401 at thompson87.com>
>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>>>>>
>>>>> These are manufactured by SSI Custom Plastics in Hollywood, Maryland.
>>>>> They were very helpful when I called them to get a replacement a few
>>>>> years back.
>>>>>
>>>>> See http://www.ssicustomplastics.com/
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Scott Thompson
>>>>> Surprise, #653
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Irving Grunes wrote:
>>>>> > Where to buy replacement shower wand and hose
>>>>> > Irv grunes
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> Message: 9
>>>>> Date: Wed, 1 Sep 2010 07:47:10 -0400
>>>>> From: Robert Seastream <robert.seastream at comcast.net>
>>>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>>>> Subject: [C320-list] Hurricane Earl
>>>>> Message-ID: <C517D7D0-582E-400F-85B0-7F144AED46EA at comcast.net>
>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes
>>>>>
>>>>> All:
>>>>>
>>>>> Not to unduly excite everyone, but in the event of a direct hit
>>>>> (doubtful the case here) where do you feel your boat would be safer:
>>>>> in a slip, on a mooring, or out of the water?
>>>>> I lean towards on a mooring because there's less 'things' to fly about
>>>>> and hit the boat. On land she'd be on jackstands; more likely lying
>>>>> next to them after the storm passed.
>>>>>
>>>>> Bob Seastream
>>>>> Intuition # 906
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> Message: 10
>>>>> Date: Wed, 1 Sep 2010 12:00:15 +0000
>>>>> From: ericstillwellevans at gmail.com
>>>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Hurricane Earl
>>>>> Message-ID:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> <1158712043-1283342415-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-275800562- at bda2817.bisx.prod.on.blackberry
>>>>> >
>>>>>
>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain
>>>>>
>>>>> I used to feel the same way until a Squall traveling 40mph with 85mph
>>>>> winds
>>>>> lasting only 10min dragged my boat and others and caused damage.
>>>>>
>>>>> I would think with the storm surge related to hurricanes a mooring may
>>>>> be
>>>>> fine but I would extend your mooring lines.
>>>>>
>>>>> Rick
>>>>> 724
>>>>> ------Original Message------
>>>>> From: Robert Seastream
>>>>> Sender: c320-list-bounces at lists.catalina320.com
>>>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>>>> ReplyTo: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>>>> Subject: [C320-list] Hurricane Earl
>>>>> Sent: Sep 1, 2010 7:47 AM
>>>>>
>>>>> All:
>>>>>
>>>>> Not to unduly excite everyone, but in the event of a direct hit
>>>>> (doubtful the case here) where do you feel your boat would be safer:
>>>>> in a slip, on a mooring, or out of the water?
>>>>> I lean towards on a mooring because there's less 'things' to fly about
>>>>> and hit the boat. On land she'd be on jackstands; more likely lying
>>>>> next to them after the storm passed.
>>>>>
>>>>> Bob Seastream
>>>>> Intuition # 906
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> Message: 11
>>>>> Date: Wed, 1 Sep 2010 05:01:55 -0700 (PDT)
>>>>> From: jim brown <jbrown5093 at yahoo.com>
>>>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Hurricane Earl
>>>>> Message-ID: <732454.82453.qm at web58604.mail.re3.yahoo.com>
>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>>>>>
>>>>> BoatUS has a whole section on hurricane preparation from the safest
>>>>> place
>>>>> to be to what kind of lines-not nylon- to use to what chafing gear is
>>>>> best
>>>>> etc Very helpful
>>>>>
>>>>> --- On Wed, 9/1/10, Robert Seastream <robert.seastream at comcast.net>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> From: Robert Seastream <robert.seastream at comcast.net>
>>>>> Subject: [C320-list] Hurricane Earl
>>>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>>>> Date: Wednesday, September 1, 2010, 7:47 AM
>>>>>
>>>>> All:
>>>>>
>>>>> Not to unduly excite everyone, but in the event of a direct hit
>>>>> (doubtful
>>>>> the case here) where do you feel your boat would be safer:? in a slip,
>>>>> on
>>>>> a
>>>>> mooring, or out of the water?
>>>>> I lean towards on a mooring because there's less 'things' to fly about
>>>>> and
>>>>> hit the boat.? On land she'd be on jackstands; more likely lying next
>>>>> to
>>>>> them after the storm passed.
>>>>>
>>>>> Bob Seastream
>>>>> Intuition # 906
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> Message: 12
>>>>> Date: Wed, 01 Sep 2010 08:04:23 -0400
>>>>> From: "=?utf-8?B?YXJnYXRlczJuZEBjb21jYXN0Lm5ldA==?="
>>>>> <argates2nd at comcast.net>
>>>>> To: "=?utf-8?B?Um9iZXJ0IFNlYXN0cmVhbQ==?="
>>>>> <robert.seastream at comcast.net>, C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Hurricane Earl
>>>>> Message-ID: <20100901120417.B6650448230 at homiemail-mx2.g.dreamhost.com>
>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>>>>>
>>>>> Ins req'ts?
>>>>>
>>>>> Sent from my Verizon Wireless Phone
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Reply message -----
>>>>> From: "Robert Seastream" <robert.seastream at comcast.net>
>>>>> Date: Wed, Sep 1, 2010 7:47 am
>>>>> Subject: [C320-list] Hurricane Earl
>>>>> To: <C320-List at Catalina320.com>
>>>>>
>>>>> All:
>>>>>
>>>>> Not to unduly excite everyone, but in the event of a direct hit
>>>>> (doubtful
>>>>> the case here) where do you feel your boat would be safer: in a slip,
>>>>> on
>>>>> a
>>>>> mooring, or out of the water?
>>>>> I lean towards on a mooring because there's less 'things' to fly about
>>>>> and
>>>>> hit the boat. On land she'd be on jackstands; more likely lying next
>>>>> to
>>>>> them after the storm passed.
>>>>>
>>>>> Bob Seastream
>>>>> Intuition # 906
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> Message: 13
>>>>> Date: Wed, 1 Sep 2010 08:37:18 -0400
>>>>> From: "Kurt Budelmann" <krbmd77 at charter.net>
>>>>> To: <C320-List at Catalina320.com>
>>>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Hurricane Earl
>>>>> Message-ID: <F14A55A0B8894971891B266CC66DAA25 at lchcs.org>
>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
>>>>> reply-type=response
>>>>>
>>>>> Seaworthy, the Boat US magazine showed that the best preparation was
>>>>> on
>>>>> land
>>>>> with jackstands and guide wires preventing the boat from moving. I
>>>>> think
>>>>> they had 4 to 6 guide wires anchored in the ground around the boat.
>>>>> Also,
>>>>> their insurance will offset the cost.
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Robert Seastream" <robert.seastream at comcast.net>
>>>>> To: <C320-List at Catalina320.com>
>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 01, 2010 7:47 AM
>>>>> Subject: [C320-list] Hurricane Earl
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> > All:
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Not to unduly excite everyone, but in the event of a direct hit
>>>>> (doubtful
>>>>> > the case here) where do you feel your boat would be safer: in a
>>>>> > slip,
>>>>> on
>>>>> > a mooring, or out of the water?
>>>>> > I lean towards on a mooring because there's less 'things' to fly
>>>>> > about
>>>>> > and hit the boat. On land she'd be on jackstands; more likely lying
>>>>> next
>>>>> > to them after the storm passed.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Bob Seastream
>>>>> > Intuition # 906
>>>>> >
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> Message: 14
>>>>> Date: Wed, 1 Sep 2010 12:38:56 +0000
>>>>> From: "Jeff Hare" <catalina at thehares.com>
>>>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Hurricane Earl
>>>>> Message-ID:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> <255742206-1283344729-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-419593409- at bda284.bisx.prod.on.blackberry
>>>>> >
>>>>>
>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain
>>>>>
>>>>> In our area Bob, land is the best option as yards around here are used
>>>>> to
>>>>> blocking boats on stands for high winds. Maybe 100 mph winds would
>>>>> require
>>>>> some staked lines or tied off on trees. I know my boat with cover has
>>>>> done
>>>>> fine in 70mph on land. Ins companies will often pay for haulout if a
>>>>> storm
>>>>> is imminent and damage is likely.
>>>>>
>>>>> I would say moorings next assuming the mooring block and tackle is
>>>>> solid.
>>>>>
>>>>> Docks are the worst because the boat will get pounded a lot and can't
>>>>> face
>>>>> the wind.
>>>>>
>>>>> Take your canvas down, center the boom and tie off the aft end to both
>>>>> stern cleats. Secure all loose lines and lead halyards where they
>>>>> won't
>>>>> chaffe on the spreaders.
>>>>>
>>>>> -Jeff
>>>>>
>>>>> ------Original Message------
>>>>> From: Robert Seastream
>>>>> Sender: c320-list-bounces at lists.catalina320.com
>>>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>>>> ReplyTo: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>>>> Subject: [C320-list] Hurricane Earl
>>>>> Sent: Sep 1, 2010 7:47 AM
>>>>>
>>>>> All:
>>>>>
>>>>> Not to unduly excite everyone, but in the event of a direct hit
>>>>> (doubtful the case here) where do you feel your boat would be safer:
>>>>> in a slip, on a mooring, or out of the water?
>>>>> I lean towards on a mooring because there's less 'things' to fly about
>>>>> and hit the boat. On land she'd be on jackstands; more likely lying
>>>>> next to them after the storm passed.
>>>>>
>>>>> Bob Seastream
>>>>> Intuition # 906
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> Message: 15
>>>>> Date: Wed, 1 Sep 2010 10:07:45 -0500
>>>>> From: chester carson <cmkit10 at gmail.com>
>>>>> To: C320-List at catalina320.com
>>>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] muffler and electrical excitment
>>>>> Message-ID:
>>>>> <AANLkTimJm2YoBp05rCzKkLKsTonCSdZ4-GGBk+2m9=Gd at mail.gmail.com>
>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>>>>>
>>>>> Pat
>>>>> that is similar to the fire I had and the catalina solution is to fuse
>>>>> the
>>>>> battery charger wires at the battery. They have a diagram with specs
>>>>> that
>>>>> they can send you. I believe that ABYC now requires this on new boats.
>>>>> Kit Carson
>>>>> #223
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Aug 31, 2010 at 7:10 PM, pat reynolds <lorasalum at yahoo.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> > As a religious follower of the wisdom imparted on this site since
>>>>> > its'
>>>>> > inception, I have been fortunate to have avoided many of the
>>>>> > problems
>>>>> cited,
>>>>> > ie; head odors (freshwater boat), charger problems, corrosion etc.
>>>>> > In
>>>>> the
>>>>> > 15 years we have owned the boat I have only had the muffler and the
>>>>> > electrical fuel pump replaced. ( I know, I just opened pandora's
>>>>> > box).
>>>>> > > I
>>>>> do
>>>>> > have a water under the liner problem which I have been meaning to >
>>>>> > address
>>>>> > for several of those 15 years (again freshwater only). I think
>>>>> fortunately
>>>>> > however that that problem may have saved the boat.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > On a recent single handed return from a long distance race on Lake
>>>>> Michigan
>>>>> > (blessed freshwater) I was awaken at anchor at 3 am by the bilge
>>>>> > pump
>>>>> > cycling. It seems that the year old replacement muffler I had gotten
>>>>> from
>>>>> > Catalina had developed two leaks in the bottom (worse than the 14
>>>>> > year
>>>>> old
>>>>> > one I replaced) and motoring that day had filled the bilges and >
>>>>> > assorted
>>>>> > pockets. Tired and grumbling since I was still 100 miles from home,
>>>>> > I
>>>>> > removed the floor boards and hand pumped for a couple of hours. Some
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > of
>>>>> the
>>>>> > water remained, as always, under the liner.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > I had the muffler reglassed at the next port and continued on. Two
>>>>> nights
>>>>> > later while in a slip, again at 4 am during a bad electrical storm,
>>>>> > I
>>>>> > smelled something burning. I had a fan running off the shore power
>>>>> > and
>>>>> > thought it had overheated but it was cool. I turned on the cabin >
>>>>> > lights
>>>>> > which run off the batteries and noticed a faint wisp of smoke coming
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > from
>>>>> > behind the electrical panel. It was heavier when I opened the panel.
>>>>> > Opening the battery compartment I could see that the charger wire
>>>>> > insulation had burned completely off and these wires had fused onto
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > and
>>>>> > burned the battery cables. These wires run under the liner through
>>>>> conduit
>>>>> > from the starboard to the port side. Apparently a power surge at the
>>>>> marina
>>>>> > had come in thru the shore power cord, burned out the charger and >
>>>>> > started
>>>>> > the electrical fire. When they pulled the wiring and conduit out I >
>>>>> > could
>>>>> > see that the conduit (pvc pipe) was burned completely thru under the
>>>>> liner.
>>>>> > I am thinking
>>>>> > that maybe the water underneath had helped keep the fire from >
>>>>> > spreading.
>>>>> > Except for all of the wiring, charger and battery switch all else
>>>>> > was
>>>>> ok.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > The electrician did not reconnect the charger wires directly to the
>>>>> > battery, but to the battery switch with fuses. He said that would
>>>>> alleviate
>>>>> > some of the wiring running underneath the liner. He also said that
>>>>> > the
>>>>> > reason that the charger breaker did not pop was because the charge >
>>>>> > went
>>>>> thru
>>>>> > the negative side seeking ground.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > This was just a long way of saying that we should be aware of the >
>>>>> > wiring
>>>>> > which is run thru and under the liner from the engine, charger,
>>>>> > panel
>>>>> etc.
>>>>> > In additon to being inaccessible it may also be subject to chafe and
>>>>> > fraying. If I am ever on the boat again during an electrical storm I
>>>>> will
>>>>> > immediately remove the shore power cord.
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> Message: 16
>>>>> Date: Wed, 1 Sep 2010 08:57:34 -0700 (PDT)
>>>>> From: pat reynolds <lorasalum at yahoo.com>
>>>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] muffler and electrical excitment
>>>>> Message-ID: <118319.86321.qm at web36503.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks Kit I think that is what the electrician told me about the
>>>>> standards when he put the fuses on the wires at the batt switch. I
>>>>> know
>>>>> less about this field than I do computers so I forgot to ask him if
>>>>> this
>>>>> affected the way the batteries are charged on shore power, ie both
>>>>> charged
>>>>> no matter what position the switch is on.
>>>>>
>>>>> Pat
>>>>>
>>>>> --- On Wed, 9/1/10, chester carson <cmkit10 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> > From: chester carson <cmkit10 at gmail.com>
>>>>> > Subject: Re: [C320-list] muffler and electrical excitment
>>>>> > To: C320-List at catalina320.com
>>>>> > Date: Wednesday, September 1, 2010, 10:07 AM
>>>>> > Pat
>>>>> > that is similar to the fire I had and the catalina solution
>>>>> > is to fuse the
>>>>> > battery charger wires at the battery. They have a diagram
>>>>> > with specs that
>>>>> > they can send you. I believe that ABYC now requires this on
>>>>> > new boats.
>>>>> > Kit Carson
>>>>> > #223
>>>>> >
>>>>> > On Tue, Aug 31, 2010 at 7:10 PM, pat reynolds <lorasalum at yahoo.com>
>>>>> > wrote:
>>>>> >
>>>>> > > As a religious follower of the wisdom imparted on this
>>>>> > site since its'
>>>>> > > inception, I have been fortunate to have avoided many
>>>>> > of the problems cited,
>>>>> > > ie; head odors (freshwater boat), charger problems,
>>>>> > corrosion etc.? In the
>>>>> > > 15 years we have owned the boat I have only had the
>>>>> > muffler and the
>>>>> > > electrical fuel pump replaced. ( I know, I just opened
>>>>> > pandora's box).? I do
>>>>> > > have a water under the liner problem which I have been
>>>>> > meaning to address
>>>>> > > for several of those 15 years (again freshwater
>>>>> > only).? I think fortunately
>>>>> > > however that that problem may have saved the boat.
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > On a recent single handed return from a long distance
>>>>> > race on Lake Michigan
>>>>> > > (blessed freshwater) I was awaken at anchor at? 3
>>>>> > am by the bilge pump
>>>>> > > cycling.? It seems that the year old replacement
>>>>> > muffler I had gotten from
>>>>> > > Catalina had developed two leaks in the bottom (worse
>>>>> > than the 14 year old
>>>>> > > one I replaced) and motoring that day had filled the
>>>>> > bilges and assorted
>>>>> > > pockets.? Tired and grumbling since I was still
>>>>> > 100 miles from home, I
>>>>> > > removed the floor boards and hand pumped for a couple
>>>>> > of hours.? Some of the
>>>>> > > water remained, as always, under the liner.
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > I had the muffler reglassed at the next port and
>>>>> > continued on.? Two nights
>>>>> > > later while in a slip, again at 4 am during a bad
>>>>> > electrical storm, I
>>>>> > > smelled something burning.? I had a fan running
>>>>> > off the shore power and
>>>>> > > thought it had overheated but it was cool.? I
>>>>> > turned on the cabin lights
>>>>> > > which run off the batteries and noticed a faint wisp
>>>>> > of smoke coming from
>>>>> > > behind the electrical panel.? It was heavier when
>>>>> > I opened the panel.
>>>>> > >? Opening the battery compartment I could see that
>>>>> > the charger wire
>>>>> > > insulation had burned completely off and these wires
>>>>> > had fused onto and
>>>>> > > burned the battery cables.? These wires run under
>>>>> > the liner through conduit
>>>>> > > from the starboard to the port side.? Apparently
>>>>> > a power surge at the marina
>>>>> > > had come in thru the shore power cord, burned out the
>>>>> > charger and started
>>>>> > > the electrical fire.? When they pulled the wiring
>>>>> > and conduit out I could
>>>>> > > see that the conduit (pvc pipe) was burned completely
>>>>> > thru under the liner.
>>>>> > >? I am thinking
>>>>> > >? that maybe the water underneath had helped keep
>>>>> > the fire from spreading.
>>>>> > >? Except for all of the wiring, charger and
>>>>> > battery switch all else was ok.
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > The electrician did not reconnect the charger wires
>>>>> > directly to the
>>>>> > > battery, but to the battery switch with fuses.?
>>>>> > He said that would alleviate
>>>>> > > some of the wiring running underneath the liner.?
>>>>> > He also said that the
>>>>> > > reason that the charger breaker did not pop was
>>>>> > because the charge went thru
>>>>> > > the negative side seeking ground.
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > This was just a long way of saying that we should be
>>>>> > aware of the wiring
>>>>> > > which is run thru and under the liner from the engine,
>>>>> > charger, panel etc.
>>>>> > >? In additon to being inaccessible it may also be
>>>>> > subject to chafe and
>>>>> > > fraying.???If I am ever on the boat
>>>>> > again during an electrical storm I will
>>>>> > > immediately remove the shore power cord.
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > >
>>>>> >
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> End of C320-list Digest, Vol 882, Issue 1
>>>>> *****************************************
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Chris Burti Farmville, NC
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Chris Burti Farmville, NC
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Chris Burti Farmville, NC
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