[C320-list] fin vs. wing keel

[Andrew Santangelo]

Lou,

I have seen two wing keels auger into the mud on Lake Macatawa in Michigan (one with sails flying).  One boat seemed to panic and got stuck further; it needed a power boat to get them out.  I never ran aground with the wing, but then again I made it a point to keep away from shallow water.  Of course there are other options with a wing in areas where you can use the tide to your advantage.  Just do not run aground during high tide.

The one time I did run around with the fin. I had my crew lean to the side to heal the boat to change the effective draft; we floated and backed out.

Best Regards,
Andrew 

C320
"Dawn Treader"
#333
San  Francisco


On Oct 29, 2011, at 11:22 AM, BAdams3491 at aol.com wrote:

> I've been aground once in my C320.  The boat was in forward,  at an idle 
> with the sails down.  Put it in reverse immediately and powered  off...bottom 
> was hard.
> 
> Bert
> At Ease
> #442
> 
> 
> In a message dated 10/29/2011 10:15:38 A.M. Central Daylight Time,  
> lou at flyingmonkey.im writes:
> 
> I'd like  to hear from those who have actually experienced a grounding with 
> the wing  keel. This is my first wing keel vessel and I'd like to know what 
> to expect  when it happens. I'm a realist when it comes to these things. 
> There are those  who have run aground and those who have not "yet" run 
> aground.  
> 
> Thanks,
> Lou Hodac
> S/V Blue Moon
> Hull#702
> 
> Sent from my  iPhone
> 
> On Oct 29, 2011, at 11:00 AM, Andrew Santangelo  
> <andrew_santangelo at mac.com> wrote:
> 
>> Hello All,  
>> 
>> I would also add the fin keel works for most of the great  lakes.  We had 
> some close calls in the Kalamazoo River in Saugatuck off  Lake Michigan, 
> otherwise the fin keel also works great in this region.   
>> 
>> The big issue is if you plan to race your vessel at all and  want a 
> chance to place you really need to go to the fin keel - the pointing  ability and 
> carrying less mass is a huge difference.  Now I cruised  extensively all 
> over the great lakes before racing and I still cruise quite a  bit and I have 
> to say pointing better towards my destination and going a tad  faster to 
> beat some coming weather is an added boost I love. I have also see a  few wing 
> keels run aground.  It is not pretty getting off vs. a fin  keel.    When 
> sailing in shallow water, I really try to avoid  cutting it close regardless 
> of fin or wing keel.  Of course that is what  GPS, chart plotters and tide 
> charts are for.
>> 
>> Regarding west  coast sailing since I did the massive move/shipping of 
> Dawn Treader to SFO -  lots of wind, you fly with the tides (weather you want 
> to or not), and a fin  keel is totally fine.
>> 
>> Best Regards,
>> Andrew 
>> 
>> C320
>> "Dawn Treader"
>> #333
>> San  Francisco
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Oct 29, 2011, at 9:03 AM, Brad  Kuether wrote:
>> 
>>> If you can sail comfortably in your waters  without worrying about going 
> aground get the fin.  The performace  difference is remarkable.   But if 
> you have any doubt on depth, you  open up a LOT of options with the wing.  And 
> to be honest, I move along  OK.  (folding prop really helps here...) 
> Pointing is a different  matter.  I find with the 150 up front and sheeted in 
> tight, I do better,  but nothing great.
>>> 
>>> My prior C&C had a 5'4" fin,  and that was boarderline.  I did OK in the 
> upper Chesapeake.  Some  anchorages were out of scope.
>>> 
>>> 6 feet plus under a  Catalina 320?  No way.  Not here.
>>> 
>>> -Brad,  Mary, Monica, and Jarod
>>> "Independence"
>>> 2004 Catalina  320 Hull 1006
>>> Middle River, MD
>>> 
>>> PS - First  snowfall of the season has begun in earnest.  Its supposed 
> to be bright  and sunny with highs still in the low 60s!!!!!!
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Burti"  <clburti at gmail.com>
>>> To:  <C320-List at catalina320.com>
>>> Sent: Friday, October 28, 2011  1:15 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] fin vs. wing keel
>>> 
>>> 
>>> The simplest rule of thumb is for East Coast  cruising...get a wing
>>> keel...West Coast, a fin is  fine.
>>> 
>>> There is simply too much thin water South of  Norfolk not to take
>>> advantage of the extra foot of  clearance..
>>> 
>>> On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 12:58 PM, Gene  Helfman <genehelfman at gmail.com> 
> wrote:
>>>> Dear all: In our  ongoing search for a 320 (ca. 2000 +/-), we've run 
> into a
>>>> mixture of opinions on the qualities of the shallow vs. deep draft  
> boats.
>>>> We have a harbor and hoist situation in our home port  that makes 6 ft 
> draft
>>>> problematic but not impossible. Would  anyone like to chime in on the 
> costs
>>>> and benefits of the wing  keel boats (of which fewer were produced and 
> are
>>>> harder to  find) vs. the deeper-draft fin keel boats? We intend to 
> cruise
>>>> not race so faster turning isn't much of an issue.
>>>> 
>>>> thanks,
>>>> gene
>>>> --
>>>> Gene Helfman, Professor Emeritus
>>>> Odum  School of Ecology, University of Georgia
>>>> PERMANENT  address:
>>>> 498 Shoreland Dr., Lopez Is., WA  98261
>>>> (360) 468-2136
>>>> genehelfman at gmail.com
>>>> 
>>>> "Give a man a fish and  he'll eat for a day,
>>>> Teach a man to fish and he'll deplete  the
>>>> oceans."
>>>>