[C320-list] mystery leak

[Warren Updike]

Bronwen, I was intrigued by your story. We, too, have quite a history with
our shallow bilge. When we bought our #62 10 years ago, the stringers had
been drilled and plugged according to the plan provided by Catalina, a copy
of which I believe is on the C320 web site. So, water from under the "V"
could never reach the bilge pump other than overflowing the stringers. Plus,
the isolated spaces under the sole on the stbd side had not been emptied by
the PO and the moisture seeped through the plywood ruining some of the teak
and holly under the table pedestal. I fixed the sole by removing the rotted
wood and filling with epoxy. I also "painted" the underside of the sole with
unfilled epoxy to seal it from future problems.
I won't bore everyone with the rest of the story other than to say that,
over the years, it has been a (minor) continuing battle with fresh water
leaks going undetected and water finding its way into the space between the
liner and hull. With the leaks fixed, life returns to normal. The bilge
configuration was a poor design by Catalina that was fixed early in the 320
history. Still, we are happy with our baby and continue to enjoy cruising
the length and width of the Chesapeake Bay. 
I'm comforted by the realization that each vessel comes with its own
particular set of issues. 

Warren and Pattie Updike
1994 C320 "Warr de Mar" #62

-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Sulewski [mailto:rsulewski at bex.net] 
Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2014 8:37 AM
To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
Subject: Re: [C320-list] mystery leak

Bronwen,
Based on my experience with a shallow bilge model similar to your hull
series ( we have a 1995 C320, Hull #277) we  struggled with occasional water
under the hull liner during our first season. We experienced enough water in
the bilge to cause an overflow of bilge water from the shallow bilge into
the space below the hull liner as you described whenever we sailed heavy
weather conditions and found that water was entering our storage areas under
the settee. We learned that most of the water we had under the liner was
coming from the packing gland after we had eliminated all other variables
that have been covered in this discussion list, such as water leaking from
freshwater system. We also looked for water leaking from the fixed port
windows (the 3 non-opening port windows) since the gaskets on those fixed
port windows could also be a source of water intrusion finding its way into
the hull liner whenever those fixed port windows receive a good bath while
heeling. Check to learn if the hull side trim ring show signs of missing
gasket material from the two horizontal gaps in the trim ring.  May also
look for water stains running down the interior wood below those port
windows.

If you have any amount of water in your bilge, it could find its way under
the hull liner since you have a shallow bilge 320. The  solution I found
successful was to reduce, and strive to eliminate, the amount of water in
the bilge before leaving the dock. What I found to be successful was to
segregate the bilge sections by plugging the bilge water drain tube that
allows the water to flow forward from the  bilge pump section to the other
bilge sections, and then removing all of the water from each of those
forward bilge sections. Now I can manage the bilge water that is restricted
to the pump area since bilge water cannot routinely  flow forward into the
other shallower bilge sections. That way, heeling the boat ceased to cause
the larger amount of bilge water from splashing out of the shallower bilge
sections forward of the pump section.  I made the modifications 19 seasons
ago and now I occasionally monitor water entering the forward most bilge
cavity by removing a small cabin sole board (that I no longer screw down)
forward of the mast post that can be easily removed to check for any
moisture (not having found any). I also remove the aft most areas of  cabin
sole (behind the bilge pump section) where there is a hidden inspection
port,  to look for water under the liner. That only required making two 2
small cuts of the cabin sole so those two small sections of the cabin sole
can now be removed over that inspection port. That inspection port is
normally concealed by the larger most aft sections of the largest sections
of the cabin sole. One must pull up the largest sections of the cabin sole
to see the inspection port and it will then become obvious where the two
cabin sole sections can be removed by making a couple of cuts with a table
saw or even a jig saw if you have a steady hand. By creating access to the
hull liner inspection port,  I can now easily removed those two small boards
(and often do not screw them down) to determine if any water is below the
bilge hull liner. Upon the rare occasion I may find water, mostly from rain
water seeping through the companionway hatch during heavy rains, the water
can easily be removed from under the liner from that inspection port with a
small one gallon shop vac (that I store in the aft locker). 

The trick to reducing the amount of water entering the bilge pump area was
to strive for a smaller amount of water seeping past the adjustable packing
gland. For about 15 seasons I used Teflon coated packing material plus a
green Teflon paste lubricant to annually coat the shaft area where the
packing has contact. I also added an additional ring of packing material
every 3-5 years as needed. 5 years ago I switched to Gortex packing that
does not require any packing lubricant. If I end up with any excessive
amount of water in the bilge pump section, I simply use a dinghy hand bilge
pump to pass that water into the sink before leaving the dock, or I get out
the small shop vac.  Checking for water in the bilge section ahead of the
mast post and reducing the amount of water in the bilge pump section over
the years has become normal routines and ensures that we have no have water
under the hull liner when I pull up those small cabin sole boards to access
the hull liner inspection port.

Given all of other variables you are juggling from the good advice you
received from other owners, perhaps this information about how to manage a
shallow bilge may also prove to be helpful.

Rick
My-Ria 1995 320, Hull #277

-----Original Message-----
From: c320-list-bounces at lists.catalina320.com
[mailto:c320-list-bounces at lists.catalina320.com] On Behalf Of Bronwen Young
Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2014 12:45 AM
To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
Subject: Re: [C320-list] mystery leak

Thanks guys for the replies.  Yes, we knew about having only one tank going
at a time.
We have not drilled the holes that Catalina talked about.  We do not want
water from the real bilge being able to get into the secondary bilge.  The
real bilge is operating perfectly.  Our problem is that somehow, from
somewhere, water is getting into the secondary bilge.  [Since it can't get
out, it leads to odour.]  The big puzzle at this point is that the leak
seems to be increased by healing the boat??

Thanks,
Bronwen & Eric
FanaSea, #198