[C320-list] Wing vs Fin

[Warren Updike]

I guess that depends. The way I did it with 12' of chain it was never a problem and it always hung on the rope rode. As long as the chain is well away from the boat it should still work as long as the rope rode reaches below the keel and the snatch block and weight stay on the rode above the chain.

Warren and Pattie Updike
1994 C320 "Warr de Mar" #62

-----Original Message-----
From: Kirk Mueller [mailto:kirkm753 at gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, July 20, 2015 4:53 PM
To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
Subject: Re: [C320-list] Wing vs Fin

Hey Warren,

Will the system using the snatch block work if you have both rope and
chain?  Thanks for the the great explanation.

Cheers,

Kirk Mueller
"We Go Now"  #361
Haven Harbour Marina, Rock Hall


On Sun, Jul 19, 2015 at 1:24 PM, Warren Updike <wupdike at hotmail.com> wrote:

> Ted, I think, perhaps, my explanation was not sufficient. Here is more
> detail in answer to your questions.
>
> The knot is tied in the line to lie at the cleat I secure the line to. The
> distance from the knot to the weight is the distance above the water plus
> about 6' to insure the weight is below the keel when the rode is slack.
>
> I used to use a small mushroom anchor until I lost it (13lbs, I think.) I
> then used what I had which is a small grappling (dinghy) anchor with the
> flukes tied in-place. The weight is connected to a snatch block so it can
> be
> quickly attached to the rode. The line is attached to the block and the
> weight easily slides down the rode to the proper distance and I secure the
> line to a bow cleat at the knot.
> The weight and knot are a different ends of the rig.
> No chaf as the snatch block rolls on the rode, slick as snot on a doorknob.
>
> This rig is similar in design and deployment to an anchor kellett except
> the
> kellett is heavy and intended to increase the catenary of the rode. My rig
> is only effective when the rode is slack which is when the danger of keel
> wrap is present.
>
> Warren and Pattie Updike
> 1994 C320 "Warr de Mar" #62
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: tharrison at innovations-plus.com [mailto:
> tharrison at innovations-plus.com]
>
> Sent: Friday, July 17, 2015 6:01 PM
> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Wing vs Fin
>
> Warren just a couple of questions on your method.
>
> How far from the bow is the knot?
>
> What kind of weight do you use that it slides down to the knot?
>
> What prevents the weight from going over the knot?
>
> Does the weight chaf the rode?
>
> Ted
> Hull 424
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Jul 17, 2015, at 5:34 PM, Warren Updike <wupdike at hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Wrapping the rode around a wing keel can be inconvenient. What I do to
> avoid this condition is to run a weight out on the rode so that if the rode
> is slack the weight will keep the rode below the keel. I have a knot in the
> line so I know how far to let it out to clear the keel. Of course, if there
> is wind and/or tide the rode will be taught so no danger of a wrap. This is
> not the same as a kellett as it is only about 15lb. while a kellett is
> probably 30 or more lbs.
> >
> > Warren and Pattie Updike
> > 1994 C320 "Warr de Mar" #62
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Gene Helfman [mailto:genehelfman at gmail.com]
> > Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2015 8:40 PM
> > To: C320-List at catalina320.com
> > Subject: Re: [C320-list] Wing vs Fin
> >
> > When shopping a few years ago for a C320, we sought advice on the wing vs
> > fin keel issue, considering the shallower draft advantage of the wing
> > keel.  The higher pointing of the fin keel boat came up repeatedly but I
> > don't know if it was resolved.  One liability of the wing keel that is
> more
> > than hypothetical is the chance of an anchor line getting wrapped around
> > the fins when wind and current run in opposite directions, a not uncommon
> > occurrence.  Also, if the keel depth of the shallower draft wing keel
> boat
> > is less than or equal to the rudder depth, the rudder may settle down on
> or
> > strike the bottom first when water depth is miscalculated or stranded by
> a
> > falling tide (which we of course never do.....).  I'd be curious to know
> if
> > wing keel owners have experience with this.
> >
> >> On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at 3:09 PM, Dick Walker <dickwalker at att.net>
> wrote:
> >>
> >> David I hope you will be here for the 2016 Regatta at Coronado YC ; 9-11
> >> September 2016
> >>
> >> If any on the list have questions please contact me,
> >>
> >> If you are planning to come drop me an email
> >>
> >>
> >> Cheers
> >>
> >> Dick Walker
> >> C-320 #687. WindWalker II
> >> 740 Olive Ave.
> >> Coronado ,CA 92118
> >> 619.435.8986
> >>
> >> Dickwalker at att.net
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>> On Jul 16, 2015, at 14:29, Utility Email <kswanson123 at comcast.net>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> John,
> >>>
> >>> We have a fin keel C320.  We live in both San Diego and Seattle area
> and
> >> have sailed our C320 in both places.  We currently keep the boat in
> Seattle.
> >>>
> >>> There is a serialized list of C320's on the C320 owners website. I
> >> believe that list shows whether or not the boat is a fin or wing keel.
> You
> >> may be able to get a sense of production quantities from that list.
> Also
> >> search the sailboat and cruisers forums about wing vs fin keel Catalina
> >> sailboats and I am sure you will find a lot of input there as well.
> >>>
> >>> I understand that the fin keel will point a little higher than a wing
> >> keel.  Makes sense when considering the lift that a fin keel generates
> >> compared to a traditional crushing boat lead bulb wing keel.
> >>>
> >>> We have been really happy with our C320 fin keel in both SD, SoCal and
> >> Catalina Island sailing as well as sailing in Puget Sound, the San Juan
> and
> >> Canadian Gulf Islands. It is the perfect boat for us.
> >>>
> >>> Dave
> >>>
> >>> David Swanson
> >>> S/V Emily Ann
> >>> 2007 Catalina 320 Mk II
> >>> No. 1107
> >>> Mukilteo, Washington
> >>>
> >>>> On Jul 16, 2015, at 1:04 PM, John Eddy <johneddy123 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> Hi everyone,
> >>>>
> >>>> I am in the market for a C-320 fin keel. There are a number of 320's
> on
> >>>> yachtworld, but most are the wing keel version. Can anyone tell me how
> >> many
> >>>> of each were built? It appears the fin was the *option* according to
> >> what I
> >>>> can gather from "the Google"... Can anyone assist?
> >>>>
> >>>> We're in the Pacific NW so skinny water not a concern...has anyone
> owned
> >>>> both versions? I know the race vs cruising argument but I DO like
> >>>> performance.
> >>>>
> >>>> Thanks all,
> >>>>
> >>>> Best regards,
> >>>>
> >>>> John
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Gene Helfman, Professor Emeritus
> > Odum School of Ecology, University of Georgia
> > PERMANENT address:
> >    498 Shoreland Dr., Lopez Is., WA 98261
> >    (360) 468-2136
> >    genehelfman at gmail.com
> >
> > "You noticed nobody gives a damn about beached minnows."
> >
> >
>
>
>