[C320-list] Dodger windows

[Jeff Hare]

Scott, 

I'll offer these as opinions based on my current experience, but other
fabricators with more experience may be able to point to different success
cases that contradict these.

BTW, I'm amending my notes below on 80gauge, as just I spoke with a
fabricator who was not happy with it in the field.  I also made a typo: *40
gauge* is still the best thickness for dodgers, but you can use 60 if really
wanted thick clear but semi flexible windows. It's expensive however.

My recommendation is O'Sea 40gauge for window material.  It's very scratch
resistant compared with some other flexible window materials (Recent
Strataglass 40gauge is also coated and comparably scratch resistant, just
not sunscreen/bug spray resistant.  Not that anyone on a sailboat would use
either of those.).  40 gauge will roll nicely and is easy to handle.

So, I think flexible solar panels can be troublesome mounted directly on the
Sunbrella if not done well, but it depends on the brand and how they are
attached.  It may not be a good idea to mount them so that they draping over
any of the support bows. Some panels mounted this way have resulted in fires
because of the flexing point over the bow.  Mounting them between the bows
might have your Bimini sagging more than you might like after a year or so.
If your bimini is attached correctly, the canvas should be really tight,
nearly drum tight. Loose Sunbrella that flaps in the wind will wear out so
much faster than a tight installation. Sunbrella stretches, solar panels
don't so there can be some tension between these two and that results in
ripples and pull lines.  Even if you use good marine Velcro, you'll only get
a few years out of it so be prepared to replace that every so often. Velcro
just doesn't hold up in this environment. #5 YKK Zippers that are covered
might be a good choice if the fabricator is careful to pre-tension the
fabric when doing the layout.

I'll dig through my stuff from vendors and see if anything jumps out that
might be worth a look or prompt some other ideas.

My suggestion is to see examples from as many different fabricators as you
can.  You'll get a good sense who has good ideas for doing that.  Look
carefully at the stitching as well, it should be straight, and there
shouldn't be overlaps where they ran out of thread and restarted. Glass
should be sewn between layers of fabric and you shouldn't see the raw
plastic edges on the inside. We can talk offline if you really want to know
what to look for.

-Jeff

-----Original Message-----
From: C320-list [mailto:c320-list-bounces at lists.catalina320.com] On Behalf
Of Scott Thompson
Sent: Wednesday, October 5, 2016 3:47 PM
To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
Subject: Re: [C320-list] Dodger windows

This is very apropos since I probably will want to replace my dodger and
Bimini this winter. (Ours are 18 years old!)

Jeff, is it possible to roll the middle panel with the O'Sullivan that you
recommend? And where can I read more on this topic?

We will probably be adding flexible solar panels to at least the top of the
Bimini and so am interested in any personal experiences in that dimension
too. Right now we have a rigid panel tied to the top of the Bimini and it
has made me hungry for a setup with more power. But I don't want big rigid
panels hanging off the back.

Scott

On 10/5/2016 8:18 AM, Jeff Hare wrote:
> Window material has come a long way in recent years and there are some 
> great materials out there now.
>
> Here's my take...
>
> Any of the high end materials should last 10 years minimum if cared 
> for properly. Longer in areas with less intense sun.  Ours is 16yrs 
> old this fall and still quite clear. Window covers make a big 
> difference in how long they will last.  Make sure they use SolarFix or 
> Tenara thread since they will last longer than any of the materials they
are stitching together.
>
> Consider your design and how you want things to work (zippers, 
> openings,
> etc) before you choose the window material.
>
> Polycarbonate - (Makrolon) is more difficult to work with and will be 
> a bit more expensive. Stitching through this material is a chore, but 
> now there are some adhesive options which seem to work well also.  
> You'll want to choose a canvas maker who is on top of the technology if
you go this route.
> With PC, you will have some limitations on how you can open up the 
> center forward panel for ventilation because you can't just unzip it 
> and roll it up.
>
> EZ2CY - (no firsthand experience) makes semi rigid acrylic window 
> material that's optically clear and getting a lot of attention these 
> days. Only EZ2CY dealers are authorized to make enclosures with this
material however.
> Acrylic is typically more clear than Polycarbonate and doesn't exhibit 
> the rainbow effects.
>
> O'Sullivan Films - (my preference) Makes clear flexible window 
> material in the USA up to 80gauge thicknesses which is quite stiff and
optically clear.
> Not as rigid as PC or EZ2CY's Acrylic but easier to work and comparable to
> PC in clarity.  They make two basic types:  O'Sea and Regalite   The O'Sea
> material has the added benefit of scratch resistant coatings and is 
> also Sunscreen, bug spray and fuel resistant.  The *40gauge* is a great 
> thickness for dodgers but if you want the rigid look with the benefits 
> of PC, the *60gauge* might do the trick and will be easier to handle but
won't
> roll if you ever need to remove it from the boat (like storm prep, etc.)  
> PC will probably need to be curved and may not always lay flat when
removed.
>
> Strataglass - (too many drawbacks) Similar to O'Sullivan products but 
> is more sensitive to scratches and contact with sunscreen, bug spray 
> and fuel must be avoided or it will cloud.  I'm not really a fan, but 
> it is popular and some swear by it.  They have had some mfg 
> consistency problems, but maybe those have been worked out, I'm not sure.
>
> -Jeff Hare
> #809 Woodbine II
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: C320-list [mailto:c320-list-bounces at lists.catalina320.com] On 
> Behalf Of rross at pillerross.com
> Sent: Wednesday, October 5, 2016 2:09 AM
> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
> Subject: [C320-list] Dodger windows
>
> What is the general consensus regarding Lexan windows versus regular 
> windows.
>
>   
>
>   
>