[C320-list] Outhaul line length and diameter

[Irving Grunes]

We also attached blocks to the reefing cringles to minimize friction
Irv Grunes

On Fri, Sep 30, 2016 at 4:44 PM, Scott Thompson <surprise at thompson87.com>
wrote:

> There seems to be a lot of misunderstanding about what is inside the boom
> and why. The block and tackle for the outhaul is completely different from
> and not interchangeable with the shuttle block used for single line
> reefing. Have a look at the picture in the Charleston Spar manual on the
> website for a look at the outhaul block and tackle. I know I have this on
> my boat but perhaps it was not used on other boats.
>
> Regarding the single line reefing system using the floating shuttle block:
> If you rig it appropriately then it REDUCES friction. That's because most
> of the friction in the typical single line reefing setup that does not use
> the block comes from pulling the reef line through the reefing cringles on
> the sail, not from the floating block. And proper rigging of the floating
> block cuts the amount of line you need to pull through the forward reef
> cringle by at least half, and can cut it to zero if you rig using a hook as
> shown in the Catalina manual. The use of the internal floating shuttle
> block also makes it much easier to remove the mainsail from the boom.
>
> The internal shuttle block does NOT add mechanical advantage to the
> reefing system because it is a 2:2 block. It does reduce friction, however.
>
> Scott
>
> Surprise, #653
>
> On 9/26/2016 3:22 PM, Graeme Clark wrote:
>
>> Irv
>>
>> Excellent observation! We had reefing line through block but only because
>> that's how it's always been and the picture in the manual shows it that way
>>
>> But in practice we tend to head up into wind to reef (or heave to) as
>> that reduces pressure on sail and I'm not sure the mechanical advantage is
>> needed - there's the additional friction too! Also the second reefing line
>> doesn't have an equivalent!
>>
>> Maybe the block would indeed be better used for the outhaul. Interesting
>> thought.
>>
>> Graeme
>> #366, 1996
>>
>> Sent from mobile: please excuse typos etc.!
>>
>>
>> On 26 Sep 2016, at 20:06, Irving Grunes <igrunes at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Warren
>>> When we had #851, we thought that the outhaul required the most
>>> mechanical
>>> advantage and so used the inside boom block configuration foe the
>>> outhaul.
>>> It would be interesting why others do what they do and for what reason.
>>> Irv Grunes
>>> Lurker from former #851
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, Sep 26, 2016 at 2:35 PM, Warren Updike <wupdike at hotmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On my #62, the outhaul is a single line through the boom. It's the
>>>> reefing
>>>> line that uses the block in the boom. I find the block can be retrieved
>>>> from the aft end of the boom by pulling both parts of the outhaul out
>>>> from
>>>> the opening at the end. The block will fit through this opening.
>>>>
>>>> Warren and Pattie Updike
>>>> 1994 C320 "Warr de Mar" #62
>>>> Middle River, Chesapeake Bay
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Dave Ouimette [mailto:drouimette at aol.com]
>>>> Sent: Saturday, September 17, 2016 1:30 PM
>>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Outhaul line length and diameter
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Scott,
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for the response.
>>>>
>>>> I have no idea if I have a block inside the boom that handles the
>>>> outhaul
>>>> on my 1995 C320. From memory (I don't have access to the boat right
>>>> now),
>>>> it seems I don't. The manual I have only shows a block in the boom for
>>>> single line reefing and none for the outhaul. So I'm going to have to
>>>> pull
>>>> the thing apart to know for sure when I'm able to get to the boat in a
>>>> couple of weeks.
>>>>
>>>> If there are others on the Discussion List who have older boats I would
>>>> appreciate hearing about your outhaul setup.
>>>>
>>>> Dave
>>>> Hull 174
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Scott Thompson <surprise at thompson87.com>
>>>> To: C320-List <C320-List at Catalina320.com>
>>>> Sent: Sat, Sep 17, 2016 10:30 am
>>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Outhaul line length and diameter
>>>>
>>>> Keep in mind that the outhaul is actually two separate lines. The
>>>> control line runs through a 3:1 block and tackle inside the boom and
>>>> exits at the gooseneck jammer. The line that exits the outboard end of
>>>> the boom is attached to the floating end of the tackle  inside the boom.
>>>> I believe that Chris' estimate of length is for the control line only.
>>>> The other working piece will be much shorter.
>>>>
>>>> Another consideration: You need to be able to extract the floating block
>>>> from the end of the boom to replace the lines, since both lines dead end
>>>> at the two ends of this block. In order to have enough slack, the
>>>> control line needs to be about 3 times the length of the boom, or more,
>>>> since the internal block and tackle is 3 to 1. But if you are using the
>>>> jammer at the gooseneck, this is much  more slack than you need for
>>>> normal sailing, since the difference between completely tight outhaul
>>>> and one slacked for downwind sailing is only a few feet of control line
>>>> movement. I keep all of the excess coiled and hung on the cleat at the
>>>> side of the mast. But a better solution that has been on my "to do" list
>>>> for some time, would be to make the line shorter with a small reeving
>>>> splice in the end. In normal usage I would also tie a stopper knot in
>>>> the end. Then, if I need to access the internal block for some reason I
>>>> would untie the stopper knot and attach a messenger line to the reeving
>>>> splice so that the line would be temporarily longer.
>>>>
>>>> Scott
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 9/17/2016 10:31 AM, Allan S. Field wrote:
>>>>>     Would suggest you rig a messenger line to the outhaul line, pull
>>>>> the
>>>>>     outhaul line through, measure the outhaul line, purchase the new
>>>>>     outhaul line, then use the messenger to pull it back through!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>     On 09/17/16, Dave Ouimette<drouimette at aol.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>     Chris,
>>>>>     Thanks for the info.
>>>>>     Our boat is in Florida and I will be heading down there soon. Looks
>>>>>     like I will need to look more closely at the setup.
>>>>>     Dave
>>>>> Hull 174
>>>>>     -----Original Message-----
>>>>>     From: Chris Burti <[1]clburti at gmail.com>
>>>>>     To: 320 <[2]C320-List at catalina320.com>
>>>>>     Sent: Fri, Sep 16, 2016 8:47 pm
>>>>>     Subject: Re: [C320-list] Outhaul line length and diameter
>>>>>     It depends on how yours is rigged... if you are using the jammer on
>>>>>
>>>> the
>>>>
>>>>>     mast end of the boomt, all you need is about 20' of 3/8" Stayset or
>>>>>     equivalent. If it runs down from there and through a block at the
>>>>>
>>>> base
>>>>
>>>>>     of
>>>>>     the mast to a clutch at the halyard winches, you will need 45-50'.
>>>>>     Chris Burti
>>>>>     Farmville, NC
>>>>>     On Fri, Sep 16, 2016 at 7:51 PM, Dave Ouimette <[3]
>>>>>
>>>> drouimette at aol.com>
>>>>
>>>>>     wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I will need to replace the outhaul line on our 1995 C320 and don't
>>>>>>
>>>>> find a
>>>>>
>>>>>> description of the length or diameter of the line in the c320
>>>>>>
>>>>> manual.
>>>>
>>>>>     Can
>>>>>
>>>>>> anyone help me with this. Thanks.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Dave
>>>>>> Hull 174
>>>>>>
>>>>> References
>>>>>
>>>>>     1. mailto:clburti at gmail.com
>>>>>     2. mailto:C320-List at catalina320.com
>>>>>     3. mailto:drouimette at aol.com
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>