[C320-list] Downwind Preventer - was Whisker Pole Length

[Monte B.]

To nit pick a topic that will probably get severely picked before this
thread is over, I agree with O.D. and Allen on the mid boom as opposed to
end boom placement for a preventer for a sloop rig, which is all I really
know. I sail primarily on an inland lake so I don't rig a preventer as often
as some might but when I do I want the line to the boom taut so an
accidental jibe never permits the boom to start across the deck, let alone
build enough momentum to bend the boom. I also rig it to a deck winch
instead of a cleat so I can release it and have some mechanical advantage on
the line. If the line is in a cleat you can't release it safely without
unloading the sail which means a 270 degree turn which can be entertaining
in the swells that accompany big winds, not to mention a wildly flogging
jib. With an end boom placement any movement of the boom now is pulling a
line to decapitate you if the boom misses. With a mid-boom placement at
least all the line movement is on the foredeck where the crew is not. After
witnessing the boom being broken off the mast at the gooseneck on a 49'
Jeneau on a delivery from San Fran. to San Diego with a professional skipper
on board I would recommend those that don't understand what a preventer is
all about to relieve the ignorance as we were lucky to not lose the rig in
winds gusting to 40 and 15 foot swells on the starboard quarter. At my
suggestion to rig a preventer, the professional replied what for? He had
broken the same gooseneck two days previous on the trip to San Fran. from
Anacortes and fortunately they sent two replacements instead of one. Can you
say roll jibe? 

Happy Jibing
Monte
Laima #620

-----Original Message-----
From: c320-list-bounces at lists.catalina320.com
[mailto:c320-list-bounces at lists.catalina320.com] On Behalf Of
Orlando.Duran at AveryDennison.com
Sent: Saturday, December 13, 2008 1:47 PM
To: C320-List
Subject: Re: [C320-list] Downwind Preventer - was Whisker Pole Length

Quick reminder, you get more leverage and less strain on the boom by doing
mid boom or 3/4, never go to the end of the boom to rig a preventer on (my
caveat here) most boats....Brian Toss mentioned that on his website
----------------------------------
Regards,
OD

Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld


----- Original Message -----
From: "Allan S. Field" [allan.field at verizon.net]
Sent: 12/13/2008 01:29 PM EST
To: <C320-List at Catalina320.com>
Subject: [C320-list] Downwind Preventer - was Whisker Pole Length



Sea Shadow is rigged for downwind sailing differently than is War De Mar and
I will try to describe what we did.  Note that the idea for this came from
Orlando Duran - I give him credit the first 2 times I share this then the
idea is all mine!

The boom sheet on our boats runs thru 2 blocks.  On the aft most block, I
hung a long shackle from the bail that the block attaches to.  This shackle
is probably 3 inches long.  From each of the forward deck cleats, I hung
long shackles probably about 4 inches long and hung a single block off each
one of them.  The reason for the long shackles here is to leave room for
mooring lines.  Moving aft, I hung a single block on the base of each
stanchion port and starboard sides.

At the base of the forward part of each side of the aft
wraparound-stanchion, I attached a block with cam cleat.

Now for the rigging.  I have 2 preventer lines, one for port, the other for
starboard (red line for port, green for starboard).  I went to West Marine's
rigger and had him splice on the end of each preventer line a heavy duty
snap shackle, the kinds with the spring loaded snaps.  These 2 shackles are
then attached to the long shackle on the mast bail previously installed (see
above).  The preventer lines then run forward to the blocks on the forward
cleats then back through the blocks at the base of the stanchions and
through the block with a cam cleat.  Once set-up, I can control the boom
100% from the cockpit.

I am a bit uncomfortable with the preventer lines coming back only to the
aft-most boom bail.  I would much prefer that they come all the way back
like Warren has done.  That will be a winter project to figure out how to do
this better but without interfering with the dodger.

Unlike Warren, I was hesitant to use the anchor roller for any of this.
Worst case scenario on Sea Shadow is that the boom breaks/bends mid-boom or
a deck cleat pulls out.  Worst case scenario on War De Mar is the anchor
plate gives way, the forestay breaks and the mast comes down.  (NOTE: I hung
a block off the anchor bail and run the spinnaker tack line through the
block and up to the ATN Tacker.  A rigger saw this and cautioned me that
this puts a tremendous amount of pressure on the anchor base and there is a
danger of it pulling out.  But the maximum apparent wind I will fly the
spinnaker is 12 knots; gets any higher, the spinnaker comes down.  And yes,
I fully expect to take some list-grief over this!)

Our downwind pole is mounted to the mast on a track so is fairly easy to
handle, much easier than when deck and/or stanchion mounted.

With this set-up, I have no hesitation about going DDW (dead downwind) under
any conditions.

Hope this helps.

Allan S. Field
Sea Shadow - #808
Columbia, MD

-----Original Message-----
From: c320-list-bounces at lists.catalina320.com
[mailto:c320-list-bounces at lists.catalina320.com] On Behalf Of warren updike
Sent: Friday, December 12, 2008 4:12 PM
To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
Subject: Re: [C320-list] Whisker Pole Length

No photos, sorry. She's under wraps now. Preventer is used for the main.

Since it is not recommended attaching a preventer mid-boom, I followed
mfgr.'s recommendation and attached a pendant of twisted nylon to the end of
the mast with a thimble spliced into the working end. The length is enough
to bring the thimble over the deck when the boom is well overboard. I use a
bungee attached to the main sheet thingy to secure the pendant when not in
use. This makes it quite easy underway with the boom outboard to unhook the
pendant attach the preventer line and secure the preventer. 

I accept the risk of starting a whole thread on how to attach/run the
preventer as I've not yet found the ideal method. Typically, I use a block
attached to the anchor roller to turn the preventer bringing it back to the
cockpit. It's faster and safer if you can control it from the cockpit. Yet,
I welcome any and all ideas on how to do it better. When not in use, the
block is pulled out of the way with a bit of light bungee tied to a vertical
on the pulpit. I don't bother to untie this, just slide it down the pulpit
to free the block for use.  Yes, it is necessary to unhook the preventer
line and run around the mast when after gybing. What price safety?

My pole is two part telescopic with 2" aluminum tubing. It's an old dude I
bought off the internet when I had a C25. It was a major reason for
upgrading to the C320. I had to protect my investment in the pole, all $150
of it. Don't think I could manage a fixed pole of 10 or 12'

Warren & Pattie Updike
Catalina 320, #62, "Warr De Mar"
Middle River, Chesapeake Bay




-----Original Message-----
From: Bruce Stanley [mailto:brucestanley36 at gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 11:19 PM
To: C320-List at catalina320.com
Subject: Re: [C320-list] Whisker Pole Length

Thanks Warren
do you have any photos of the preventer?
is it a preventer for the Main or Genoa?
is your Whisker Pole a fixed length, or telescopic one?

Bruce Stanley C320 #1084 "Fantastic Lady"
Sydney Australia
========================
On Fri, Dec 12, 2008 at 10:44 AM, warren updike <wupdike at hotmail.com> wrote:

> I have a 12' pole I use with a 150% jib. I rarely use all 12 feet.
>
> I'm using the pole mostly on downwind runs while wing'n'wing. It holds the
> jib out nicely and is easy to deploy and retireve. I also rig a preventer
> on
> the main as a precaution. I've had days where I've run N or S on the
> Chesapeake Bay for hours with this rig. Well worth the investment.
>
> Warren & Pattie Updike
> Catalina 320, #62, "Warr De Mar"
> Middle River, Chesapeake Bay
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bruce Stanley [mailto:brucestanley36 at gmail.com]
> Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 4:09 AM
> To: C320-List
> Subject: [C320-list] Whisker Pole Length
>
> The Whisker Pole Length is given as the J measurement.
> This is stated as 12'4".
> stupid question but I am trying to Measure Twice before I cut ...
>
>
>



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