[C320-list] Mainsail Hard to Raise/Lower

Tue Oct 14 13:24:03 PDT 2008

Dennis:

Thank you. I know mine is not a safety concern -- except for me having to go 
topside in choppy seas when lowering the main. I will try, try again in the 
spring.

jack
#947

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Dennis Harris" <dharris02 at embarqmail.com>
To: <C320-List at Catalina320.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 6:53 AM
Subject: Re: [C320-list] Mainsail Hard to Raise/Lower

> Dave, Robert,
>
> Regarding the narrowing of the mast groove on your in mast furling 
> systems, why don't you contact Charleston Spar directly at 704 597 1502 
> and talk directly to them regarding the problem.  If it is a serious 
> problem, they probably have a fix for it, and perhaps a fix even if it is 
> not a safety issue.  While my own mast is the conventional one with full 
> batten sail, Catalina has been using the in mast furling system for many 
> years now (it was available in 1999, and not sure how much earlier it was 
> used).  The same basic design appears to be used on lots of models other 
> than the C320.  With the large number of subscribers on the C320 list over 
> many years, if there was a serious safety issue (as in mast failure), it 
> would have come to light well before now.  Therefore, I believe you can 
> feel confident that the mast is not going to fail in normal use (assuming 
> it is rigged correctly).  Since the masts are aluminum extrusions, it is 
> probable that the same dies and metal composition have been used for all 
> boats using the C320 cross section. It is not likely to be a quality 
> control issue, but a design issue.  Where the spreaders join the mast is 
> point of high stress.  Aluminum is a ductile metal, and if overstressing 
> is not too extreme, it will tend to deform (flow) locally to releave that 
> stress ....that's what I believe has happened here.  Still not very 
> comforting and it shouldn't happen.
>
> Jack, as to Catalina switching to another vendor for masts, it probably 
> has to do with who had the best bid for the job.  Charleston Spars are 
> used on lots of boats, not just Catalinas.  Your mast gate problem seems 
> minor compared to the above concerns, and if you get the gate plate 
> adjusted properly and raise the sail by heading into the wind, with just a 
> little pressure (sail) to the side away from the gate opening, that 
> problem will go away.  Not a reason to switch from one mast manufacturer 
> to another.
>
> Hope this helps.
>
> Dennis Harris C320#694
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Jack McDonough" <mcdonough5 at verizon.net>
> To: <C320-List at Catalina320.com>
> Sent: Monday, October 13, 2008 7:39 PM
> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Mainsail Hard to Raise/Lower
>
>
>> Bob:
>>
>> As you know, I've had problems with the gate on my Charleston Spar. One 
>> has to wonder about Charleston Spar quality. I notice that the newer 
>> boats, at least last year's, have gone to a different manufacturer.
>>
>> jack
>> #947
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Robert Seastream" <robert.seastream at comcast.net>
>> To: <C320-List at Catalina320.com>
>> Cc: "Henderson, David" <dhender at allstate.com>; 
>> <c320-list at lists.catalina320.com>
>> Sent: Monday, October 13, 2008 4:18 PM
>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Mainsail Hard to Raise/Lower
>>
>>
>> David:
>>
>> Additionally, I'd appreciate any contact and procedural information
>> you receive for Charleston Spar, Catalina, etc.
>>
>> We bought our 2002 C320 in November of 2005.  We'll be looking at our
>> mast ASAP.  It's certainly out of warranty, but if (worst case) after
>> all is said mast replacement is suggested, I'll have to see what my
>> insurance carrier says.  I'd like to think they'd replace it as a
>> preemptive measure, rather than wait for a failure.
>>
>> Bob
>>
>> On Oct 13, 2008, at 7:01 PM, Robert Seastream wrote:
>>
>>> David:
>>>
>>> Thanks for your input.  Now I know it's not just me or my  imagination. 
>>> It gives me fresh perspective, and a concrete point to  proceed from.
>>>
>>> Bob
>>>
>>> On Oct 13, 2008, at 5:02 PM, Henderson, David wrote:
>>>
>>>> This is a somewhat delayed response to Bob Seastream’s post of a 
>>>> couple of weeks ago.  Bob, yes, I have had issues raising and  lowering 
>>>> my in-mast (Charleston Spar) furling main on my four year  old 320 
>>>> (#1049), and I think I have discovered a potentially  serious problem. 
>>>> I would love to know if others have encountered  this issue.
>>>>
>>>> I noticed the problem for the first time during the 2007 season.   It 
>>>> was slightly worse this past spring when I raised the main, and  now 
>>>> just last week when I tried to take it down in preparation for 
>>>> haul-out, it is worse still and I couldn’t get the sail down.  It 
>>>> appeared that the head of the sail and/or the swivel first stuck at 
>>>> the upper spreader.  I was able to force it through.  But then it 
>>>> became really stuck at the lower spreader.  I feared that the luff 
>>>> tape was cut or frayed and somehow hanging up in the groove in the 
>>>> foil.  I also wondered if perhaps there was a joint in the foil  that 
>>>> it might be catching on.
>>>>
>>>> This past weekend my 25 year old daughter went aloft to take a look 
>>>> (my days of going a loft are long over).  When she opened the  shackle 
>>>> and disconnected the sail from the swivel, the sail fell  easily down 
>>>> through the foil.  So it was now clear that the problem  was not the 
>>>> luff tape or the sail, but rather the swivel seemed to  be the culprit.
>>>>
>>>> Upon closer inspection, it became clear that groove in the outer  part 
>>>> of the mast (that the sail passes through to wind onto the  foil) was 
>>>> slightly narrowed in the area of the spreader.  And in  fact, the 
>>>> entire mast cavity had narrowed and was pinching the  swivel enough 
>>>> that it could not slide up and down through it.  She  then went up to 
>>>> the second spreader and lo and behold, same  problem, just slightly 
>>>> less severe.
>>>>
>>>> The broker who sold me the boat came by today for a look, and after 
>>>> attempting to raise and lower the swivel, he confirmed the  problem. 
>>>> He even pointed out that the narrowing in the outer mast  slot is 
>>>> readily visible by line of sight as you look up the mast.   Our joint 
>>>> conclusion is that the load carried by the spreaders is  slowly but 
>>>> surely bending the mast and narrowing the slot and  cavity, and it is a 
>>>> progressive problem.  Not being able to raise  or lower the main is the 
>>>> first level of concern, but ultimate mast  failure is obviously an even 
>>>> a greater concern.
>>>>
>>>> Though I am told that I am out of warranty, the broker immediately 
>>>> offered to contact Charleston Spar and Catalina on my behalf. 
>>>> Needless to say, I anxiously await their response.  Meantine, I  wanted 
>>>> to bring this to the attention of anyone else with a similar  vintage 
>>>> 320 that may be experiencing similar mast issues.
>>>>
>>>> Dave Henderson
>>>>
>>>> Dottie B    #1049
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>
>>>> Message: 4
>>>>
>>>> Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 20:16:39 -0400
>>>>
>>>> From: Robert Seastream <robert.seastream at comcast.net>
>>>>
>>>> Subject: [C320-list] Mainsail hard to raise
>>>>
>>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>>>
>>>> Message-ID: <AADF86C2-2204-418F-BFC2-BF17EEE6486F at comcast.net>
>>>>
>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes
>>>>
>>>> All:
>>>>
>>>> Has anyone ever had issues raising their (in mast furling) mainsail
>>>>
>>>> past roughly the two thirds point, almost requiring winching to raise
>>>>
>>>> it fully?
>>>>
>>>> We've had this issue since we bought the (used) boat.  I don't think
>>>>
>>>> there's any 'burrs' in the furler track; I'd expect rips in the luff
>>>>
>>>> if that were true.
>>>>
>>>> I'm wondering if the roller furler might have gotten bent, although I
>>>>
>>>> can't imagine how.  By comparison, the roller furling jib goes up  its'
>>>>
>>>> own track smooth as silk.
>>>>
>>>> Another question is how does one access the furling mechanism for
>>>>
>>>> inspection/repair, once the mast is unstepped?  Perhaps that's a
>>>>
>>>> question for Charleston Spars.
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>>
>>>> Bob Seastream
>>>>
>>>> Intuition # 906
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
> 