[C320-list] Mainsail Hard to Raise/Lower...update

[Robert Seastream]

All:

> I just got off the phone with Jim Kulibert (technical assistance) of  
> Charleston Spars.  He assured me that this issue isn't indicative of  
> immediate or future mast failure.  He wants me to detach and ship  
> him the car, or 'swivel' assembly that the mainsail head attaches  
> to.  He believes that turning (lathe?) it down slightly will remedy  
> the problem.  If not, he'll replace the assembly.  Now I've got to  
> find a diagram of how that assembly comes apart.


Bob Seastream # 906


> Original Message ----- From: "Dennis Harris"  
> <dharris02 at embarqmail.com>
> To: <C320-List at Catalina320.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 6:53 AM
> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Mainsail Hard to Raise/Lower
>
>
>> Dave, Robert,
>>
>> Regarding the narrowing of the mast groove on your in mast furling  
>> systems, why don't you contact Charleston Spar directly at 704 597  
>> 1502 and talk directly to them regarding the problem.  If it is a  
>> serious problem, they probably have a fix for it, and perhaps a fix  
>> even if it is not a safety issue.  While my own mast is the  
>> conventional one with full batten sail, Catalina has been using the  
>> in mast furling system for many years now (it was available in  
>> 1999, and not sure how much earlier it was used).  The same basic  
>> design appears to be used on lots of models other than the C320.   
>> With the large number of subscribers on the C320 list over many  
>> years, if there was a serious safety issue (as in mast failure), it  
>> would have come to light well before now.  Therefore, I believe you  
>> can feel confident that the mast is not going to fail in normal use  
>> (assuming it is rigged correctly).  Since the masts are aluminum  
>> extrusions, it is probable that the same dies and metal composition  
>> have been used for all boats using the C320 cross section. It is  
>> not likely to be a quality control issue, but a design issue.   
>> Where the spreaders join the mast is point of high stress.   
>> Aluminum is a ductile metal, and if overstressing is not too  
>> extreme, it will tend to deform (flow) locally to releave that  
>> stress ....that's what I believe has happened here.  Still not very  
>> comforting and it shouldn't happen.
>>
>> Jack, as to Catalina switching to another vendor for masts, it  
>> probably has to do with who had the best bid for the job.   
>> Charleston Spars are used on lots of boats, not just Catalinas.   
>> Your mast gate problem seems minor compared to the above concerns,  
>> and if you get the gate plate adjusted properly and raise the sail  
>> by heading into the wind, with just a little pressure (sail) to the  
>> side away from the gate opening, that problem will go away.  Not a  
>> reason to switch from one mast manufacturer to another.
>>
>> Hope this helps.
>>
>> Dennis Harris C320#694
>>
>>
>>>> On Oct 13, 2008, at 5:02 PM, Henderson, David wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> This is a somewhat delayed response to Bob Seastream’s post of a  
>>>>> couple of weeks ago.  Bob, yes, I have had issues raising and   
>>>>> lowering my in-mast (Charleston Spar) furling main on my four  
>>>>> year  old 320 (#1049), and I think I have discovered a  
>>>>> potentially  serious problem. I would love to know if others  
>>>>> have encountered  this issue.
>>>>>
>>>>> I noticed the problem for the first time during the 2007  
>>>>> season.   It was slightly worse this past spring when I raised  
>>>>> the main, and  now just last week when I tried to take it down  
>>>>> in preparation for haul-out, it is worse still and I couldn’t  
>>>>> get the sail down.  It appeared that the head of the sail and/or  
>>>>> the swivel first stuck at the upper spreader.  I was able to  
>>>>> force it through.  But then it became really stuck at the lower  
>>>>> spreader.  I feared that the luff tape was cut or frayed and  
>>>>> somehow hanging up in the groove in the foil.  I also wondered  
>>>>> if perhaps there was a joint in the foil  that it might be  
>>>>> catching on.
>>>>>
>>>>> This past weekend my 25 year old daughter went aloft to take a  
>>>>> look (my days of going a loft are long over).  When she opened  
>>>>> the  shackle and disconnected the sail from the swivel, the sail  
>>>>> fell  easily down through the foil.  So it was now clear that  
>>>>> the problem  was not the luff tape or the sail, but rather the  
>>>>> swivel seemed to  be the culprit.
>>>>>
>>>>> Upon closer inspection, it became clear that groove in the  
>>>>> outer  part of the mast (that the sail passes through to wind  
>>>>> onto the  foil) was slightly narrowed in the area of the  
>>>>> spreader.  And in  fact, the entire mast cavity had narrowed and  
>>>>> was pinching the  swivel enough that it could not slide up and  
>>>>> down through it.  She  then went up to the second spreader and  
>>>>> lo and behold, same  problem, just slightly less severe.
>>>>>
>>>>> The broker who sold me the boat came by today for a look, and  
>>>>> after attempting to raise and lower the swivel, he confirmed  
>>>>> the  problem. He even pointed out that the narrowing in the  
>>>>> outer mast  slot is readily visible by line of sight as you look  
>>>>> up the mast.   Our joint conclusion is that the load carried by  
>>>>> the spreaders is  slowly but surely bending the mast and  
>>>>> narrowing the slot and  cavity, and it is a progressive  
>>>>> problem.  Not being able to raise  or lower the main is the  
>>>>> first level of concern, but ultimate mast  failure is obviously  
>>>>> an even a greater concern.
>>>>>
>>>>> Though I am told that I am out of warranty, the broker  
>>>>> immediately offered to contact Charleston Spar and Catalina on  
>>>>> my behalf. Needless to say, I anxiously await their response.   
>>>>> Meantine, I  wanted to bring this to the attention of anyone  
>>>>> else with a similar  vintage 320 that may be experiencing  
>>>>> similar mast issues.
>>>>>
>>>>> Dave Henderson
>>>>> Dottie B    #1049
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> All:
>>>>>
>>>>> Has anyone ever had issues raising their (in mast furling)  
>>>>> mainsail
>>>>> past roughly the two thirds point, almost requiring winching to  
>>>>> raise
>>>>> it fully?
>>>>>
>>>>> We've had this issue since we bought the (used) boat.  I don't  
>>>>> think
>>>>> there's any 'burrs' in the furler track; I'd expect rips in the  
>>>>> luff
>>>>> if that were true.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm wondering if the roller furler might have gotten bent,  
>>>>> although I
>>>>> can't imagine how.  By comparison, the roller furling jib goes  
>>>>> up  its'
>>>>> own track smooth as silk.
>>>>>
>>>>> Another question is how does one access the furling mechanism for
>>>>> inspection/repair, once the mast is unstepped?  Perhaps that's a
>>>>> question for Charleston Spars.
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>
>>>>> Bob Seastream
>>>>> Intuition # 906