[C320-list] Replacement Sails Dutchman A system

[resloat]

Scott-I have a Garhauer solid vang which supports the boom so the topping 
lift is just used for the Dutchman system.  It sounds like you don't have 
that on your C320, so maybe this is more applicable to those folks with a 
solid vang.

I did a new UK main and Genoa last season.  The main was loose footed with 2 
Dutchman lines on an A system.  My UK folks recommended the A system as 
being easier to use, but I had to deal with a mainsail cover I did not want 
to put slits in for the monofilament lines.  The original Dutchman that came 
with the boat new was its System C with the cam cleat at the boom end to 
move the monofilaments lines down and back when putting on the mainsail 
cover.

The A system is much better than fooling around with the cam cleat adjusting 
the monofilament lines.  I did not put slits in the original main cover.

The trick I use when putting the mainsail cover on is to loosen the topping 
lift line at the clutch until the monofilament lines come out from under the 
mainsail cover just like on
the old C system when the cover is on.  I made up an 18" length of 1/8" line 
with a clip at one end that attaches to a small shackle on the end of the 
boom.  Then I tie the other end of the line with a rolling hitch on to the 
topping lift line.  Adjust the hitch to make the topping lift and 
monofilaments taught and you are done.  This worked fine all season and the 
topping lift never came loose from the rolling hitch.  You may have to play 
around with different types of lines to use which get
traction on the Dutchman topping lift line.  Mine came with high tech 
slippery line.

When I go out I just take off the main cover, untie the rolling hitch, toss 
the line in the port locker, tighten the topping lift to a pre-marked spot 
on the line and
raise the sail.

Bob Sloat
Savannah 894 (2002)
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Scott Thompson" <surprise at thompson87.com>
To: <C320-List at Catalina320.com>
Sent: Monday, December 17, 2012 5:45 PM
Subject: Re: [C320-list] Replacement sails and other upgrades


> UK Annapolis talked me into cutting slits in my mainsail cover when I made
> the same switch. I've regretted it ever since because the slits let dirt
> through the cover and onto the sail. If I were to do it again I would go
> back to the pulley system, or else use my main halyard as boom support
> when not sailing and slack the topping lift so that I could put the cover
> on over the Dutchman lines.
>
> Scott
>
> On 12/17/2012 7:31 AM, Irving Grunes wrote:
>> The fixed "pennant" I really meant the Dutchman "A" systen where the
>> dutchman line positions are fixed and it attaches to the topping lift.
>> The topping lift  is tightened when ready to drop the sail and loosened
>> about 6 inches when sailing.with the loose foot on the sail
>> We have not cut slits in our sail cover yet and so we lower the topping
>> lift so that the sail cover can go on with the Dutchman lines eased under
>> the sail cover.
>> Sorry for the misleading remark
>> Irv Grunes
>> 2001 #851
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 11:16 PM, Bruce Heyman<bruceheyman at cox.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Irv,
>>> With a fixed pennant how do you use it as a topping lift?  Or lower it
>>> to
>>> replace the dutchman lines?
>>> Bruce
>>> Somerset
>>>
>>> Bruce Heyman
>>> 949 289-8400
>>>
>>> Irving Grunes<igrunes at gmail.com>  wrote:
>>>
>>>> Alan,
>>>> We had a new sail by UK Halsey in Annapolis
>>>> His recommendation was to use a three line Dutchman and use a fixed
>>>> Dutchman pennant rather than the the pulley system.
>>>> I can assure you that it is a pleasure because it really controls the
>>>> sail
>>>> extremely well when dropping it.
>>>>
>>>> And he used just slits in the sail reinforced with webbing for the
>>> Dutchman
>>>> holes in the sail instead of the plastic discs.
>>>> And we bought a full batten and loose foot as well.
>>>> He also recommended the plastic sail track but since our boat is in a
>>>> partnership, we did not go for the extra $1000. the track would cost,
>>>> but
>>>> it sure works well where we have seen it.
>>>> Irv Grunes
>>>> 2001 #851
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 4:42 PM, Alan
>>>> Goodman<goodmanalanlee at hotmail.com
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Irv - now that you mention it (it never crossed my mind) on would
>>>>> think
>>> a
>>>>> three line Dutchman would handle the sail better when flaking.  I have
>>> seen
>>>>> three lines on C42s but does anyone actually have three lines on a
>>>>> C320?
>>>>>   Would that raise the price to $750 for installing the plastic disks
>>>>> ...
>>>>>   ouch.    Alan Hull 67 Holland MI
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Message: 4
>>>>>> Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2012 18:02:09 -0500
>>>>>> From: Irving Grunes<igrunes at gmail.com>
>>>>>> To: C320-List at catalina320.com
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Replacement sails and other upgrades
>>>>>> Message-ID:
>>>>>>        <CAE+H+CJ5spsUf5uQMvdy1CPva=
>>>>> CXAOQgO_6pk8O0aO1WorjzmQ at mail.gmail.com>
>>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Alan
>>>>>> If going new, I suggest 3 line Dutchman and loose footed main.
>>>>>> Irv Grunes
>>>>>> #851
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sat, Dec 15, 2012 at 5:35 PM, Alan Goodman<
>>>>> goodmanalanlee at hotmail.com>wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have the original sails (hull 67 1994) and while I considered
>>> moving
>>>>> to
>>>>>>> a bigger boat (C400), I decided to keep the C320.  So now I am
>>> going to
>>>>>>> have to make the expense (is anything spent on a boat ever an
>>>>> investment?)
>>>>>>> for several upgrades.  I would appreciate your feedback as to how to
>>>>> go and
>>>>>>> what you may have paid for a similar upgrade.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I almost pulled the trigger earlier this month while Catalina Direct
>>>>> had a
>>>>>>> 15% off discount on sails, but with only a day left before the sale
>>>>> expired
>>>>>>> I felt rushed and did not order them.  CD sells Ullman sails from a
>>>>> Ventura
>>>>>>> CA loft.  I am a Great Lakes cruiser (similar to coastal ocean
>>>>> conditions),
>>>>>>> so I am interested in Dacron, about 7.0 oz.  I currently have full
>>>>> battens
>>>>>>> and a bolt rope foot.  I also have the Dutchman flaking system, and
>>> CD
>>>>>>> wanted $500 extra to install the plastic disks/grommets in the sail.
>>>>>   That
>>>>>>> seemed a bit excessive to me.  Most likely I will be moving to a
>>> bigger
>>>>>>> boat in about 4 years (full retirement afloat), if that affects your
>>>>>>> recommendations.  Do any of the racers on the forum have gently used
>>>>> Dacron
>>>>>>> sails they might wish to part with?  Does anyone single hand a slab
>>>>> flaked
>>>>>>> main without a Dutchman or Lazy jacks?   The head sail seems to me
>>> to
>>>>> be an
>>>>>>> easier choice (less decisions).  Same fabric weight as the main,
>>> foam
>>>>> luff,
>>>>>>> leach and foot cords, etc.  I am looking for thoughts based upon
>>> value
>>>>> ...
>>>>>>> i.e. price to performance.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I also am going to have new interior cushions made for the salon.
>>>   Any
>>>>>>> recommendations as to foam density, foam thickness, other issues I
>>> may
>>>>> not
>>>>>>> be thinking about?  My OEM settee and dinette cushions extend beyond
>>>>> the
>>>>>>> leading edge (i.e. overhang) of the fiberglass bench structure but
>>> do
>>>>> not
>>>>>>> provide any support.  The edge of these cushions simply roll down
>>>>> behind my
>>>>>>> calves and are uncomfortable.  Anyone have new cushions made that
>>> are
>>>>> flush
>>>>>>> with the leading edge of the fiberglass bench structure?  Any
>>> thoughts
>>>>>>> about why it might be a good or bad idea?  Also, anyone have any
>>> price
>>>>>>> information as to what I should expect to pay (I'll be taking the
>>>>> existing
>>>>>>> cushions around for quotes right after the new year).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Lastly, I bought a tufted topper for the aft berth cushions but
>>> still
>>>>>>> don't find the sleeping conditions comfortable.  So I will
>>> definitely
>>>>> be
>>>>>>> purchasing a mattress.  Options are foam or coil spring (I also
>>> tried a
>>>>>>> Coleman air mattress, but it felt way too cold in the early spring
>>> and
>>>>> late
>>>>>>> fall).  Again, any advice thoughts appreciated.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That probably exhausts my boat budget for the upcoming year  ...
>>>   air
>>>>>>> conditioning and a below deck autopilot are in my dreams.
>>>>>>>
>