[C320-list] Recent traffic

[Graeme Clark]

From the other side of the “pond”…

We have always struggled for space over here - a small island country with a seafaring history - so traditionally  marina berths have been hard to come by with many marinas having waiting lists of several years (up to 10!) for a berth in popular areas such as the Solent, which if you don't know it is the center of British Yachting.

Supply and demand dictate prices so to keep your C320 berthed in one of the top marinas on the Solent, expect to pay around $10,000 a year.
Because supply is limited and demand high, “swinging moorings” are very popular for the summer season, with the boat lifted out onto the hard for winter. I’m not sure if you use the same term, but a swinging mooring is a buoy attached by a chain to a heavy weight on the seabed, usually in rows and rows and often serviced by the marina, with a water-taxi to take you to and from the boat.

In less popular areas the waiting list would generally be about three to five years for a berth and 2 to 4 years for a swinging mooring, I guess.

Whilst i am not aware of any empty slips anywhere I do get the impression that the waiting lists have shortened considerably. Apparently a lot of people who put their names on a waiting list several years ago, when contacted, tell the same story - they have ether sold their boat or given up on the idea of ever owning one.

Over here we are being told that it is a “buyers’ market” -  not that that gave me much negotiating power when i bought by C320 last year, i feel!

One thing that has become obvious to me over the years is that in Britain many many boats almost never go to sea! They either serve as a sort of floating holiday home (which compared to the cost of buying and maintaining a small apartment in a coastal holiday destination is very inexpensive) or else they remain a ‘dream’ of an owner who keeps meaning to do something about the boat that is slowly rotting where it lies.

It is amazing how many of these relatively expensive moorings and slips are occupied by boats that are clearly in need of serious maintenance before ever embarking on even the shortest passage!

Here, too, there has been some views expressed at the decline of new boaters. Young people today are hard pressed to save enough to start on home ownership, it will be many years before they are able - if ever - to afford the cost of buying and running a boat.

Rick’s final paragraph could apply equally, over here.

Best wishes

Graeme
#366, England




On 29 Oct 2015, at 04:20, Rick Sulewski <rsulewski at bex.net> wrote:

> Warren,
> In my boating region where I have lived and docked for over 25 years, the
> Western Basin of Lake Erie including the Lake Erie Islands,  there are many
> small and larger marinas that support a very large number of boaters. In my
> 600 slip marina, there has been a visible decline in the number of slip
> holders over the last 7 years. The boaters in my region are from a number of
> Midwestern states in addition to a substantial culture of boaters who
> conveniently live, or have relocated to, the Lake Erie shoreline area.  The
> Western shores of lake Erie host boaters who dock in marinas from Southern
> MI down to Toledo and along the shoreline well into Sandusky Bay. Many
> boaters docking in this region live in Cleveland, Columbus and Cincinnati
> population centers, as well as boaters from as far away as Indiana to the
> West and PA to the East. Some larger marinas are experiencing  as much as 30
> to 40% empty slips compared to only 10-15% empty slips back in 2008. There
> are a large number of boats that remain on the hard during the summer and I
> observed many boats abandoned as they sit for multiple years and decay. 
> 
> While there is a visible  decline in the  number of active slip holders,
> there also seems to be a lower annual number of new boaters to replace those
> who annually get out of boating.  Smaller used boats on trailers are
> increasingly popular in lieu of having a seasonal dock. There is a very good
> market for used boats at the right price, while I have noted a lower
> incidence of brand new boats being docked since the economy & stock market
> tanked in 2008-09. Without starting a raging political debate, one must
> understand that the lack of a real economic recovery is not very visible to
> many younger people who are not feeling secure enough to get into the larger
> boat markets. Given the uncertain business & job climate, even seasoned
> boaters are not replacing their boats  to the same degree or "buying up" as
> was the case less than a decade ago. Also must factor in the observation
> that many higher paying jobs have been permanently lost in the Midwest and
> replaced with lower wage jobs leaving many folks with less discretionary
> income to spend on boating. The result of our national leadership deficit is
> an inflated (overvalued) stock market & real-estate market and higher costs
> of daily living while personal incomes are not keeping pace with past trends
> ( very low savings interest rates with high inflationary cost spikes while
> the Federal Government  floated Quantitative Easing that actually devalued
> each of our dollars moving forward over time).  
> 
> I doubt that anything will soon change until this country addresses high
> taxes, low job growth and the out of control federal debt. The growth of
> government programs at all levels combined with the  higher costs of that
> bigger government cannot be sustained without even higher taxes and that
> will further retard job growth and personal incomes. Marina vacancies are a
> reflection of the local & national economies and the decline in my region is
> evident. The real question has to be at what point will we see a reduction
> in slips or a reduction in annual slip fees as the supply of slips is too
> far ahead of the demand?  There is a shrinking market of potential active
> boaters while many potential boaters are uncertain about their economic
> futures....while on the other hand there are many boaters who were lucky
> enough to prosper in spite of these trying times ( expanding health &
> medical fields, banking/financial industries, state, federal & local
> government employees, etc.) or, those who have retired and who made
> significant past sacrifices and are now enjoying less competition for
> transient docks!
> Rick 
> My-Ria 95' C320, hull #277
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: C320-list [mailto:c320-list-bounces at lists.catalina320.com] On Behalf
> Of Warren Updike
> Sent: Wednesday, October 28, 2015 9:33 PM
> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Recent traffic
> 
> We here on the Chesapeake Bay are experiencing something of a phenomenon re.
> boating. Some years ago, marinas were experiencing pressure for seasonal
> slips to the extent they began to run short of transient slips. Obviously, a
> season rental beats occasional transients. It was getting hard to find
> available slips, especially on week ends. Then the recession of 2008. 
> 
> Just in the past year or so, we are noticing many marinas with empty slips.
> Our own marina with over 300 sailboats usually with a waiting list now has
> maybe 20-25% empty slips. I asked the manager what he thought was happening
> in the industry (in Maryland.) He said they would like to know and are
> wondering where all the boats have gone that were previously in the empty
> slips. Good question.
> 
> What are y'all seeing in other parts of the sailing world? Anything what I
> describe?
> 
> Warren and Pattie Updike
> 1994 C320 "Warr de Mar" #62
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: argates2nd at comcast.net [mailto:argates2nd at comcast.net] 
> Sent: Tuesday, October 27, 2015 9:02 PM
> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Recent traffic
> 
> A 320 seller took a deposit this week on South Shore of Boston. 
> Turnover is not a bad thing. Rollie #182 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> 
> From: "John Meyers" <jcmeyers7 at gmail.com> 
> To: C320-List at catalina320.com 
> Sent: Tuesday, October 27, 2015 8:53:20 PM 
> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Recent traffic 
> 
> AND there are 5 of them for sale with a broker here on Lake Michigan. 
> 
> John Meyers 
> Muskegon, MI 
> 
> On Tue, Oct 27, 2015 at 4:48 PM, Warren Updike <wupdike at hotmail.com> wrote: 
> 
>> WOW! Traffic has really been light lately. Where is everyone? 
>> 
>> Can anyone remember a period when there were so many 320's on the market? 
>> There are 2 more at a broker in Havre de Grace, MD 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Warren and Pattie Updike 
>> 
>> 1994 C320 "Warr de Mar" #62 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
> 
> 
>