[C320-list] Hot water tank-draining tank
Jeff Hare
Catalina at thehares.com
Wed Aug 10 06:15:11 PDT 2016
That would only be true if the liquid were just expanding. But ice doesn't
work that way in my experience. It would freeze at the coldest parts
(outside surfaces) and work inward. As the whole thing freezes, it won't
easily change shape to fit the air space above, it'll expand outwards
sideways and then upwards in the middle when it can't expand horizontally
any more. It really depends on where the coldest surface is, which is
probably the air gap which forms top ice that wants to act like a plug.
As Allan mentioned, the key is to remove the check valve and vacuum the
water out through that fitting with the drain valve open. You'll be
completely amazed how much water comes out after the drain stops dripping!
It's at least 2 gallons, but I believe it's more...
I don't bother with the compressor (or the pink stuff) and we have no water
taste issues. We also vacuum out the water lines and the water tanks. It's
pretty easy to do the way our boat is plumbed (with the tank valves moved to
under the galley sink).
-Jeff Hare
#809
-----Original Message-----
From: C320-list [mailto:c320-list-bounces at lists.catalina320.com] On Behalf
Of Graeme Clark
Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2016 3:50 AM
To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
Subject: Re: [C320-list] Hot water tank-draining tank
Surely there is only a problem with water freezing when it is in a confined
space?
You can freeze water in a thin plastic bottle and it doesn't split - so long
as there is room for expansion
So I would have thought that any significant reduction of volume of the tank
would be adequate without the need to totally empty it?
Better safe than sorry though, I guess
Graeme
1966, #:36
Sent from mobile: please excuse typos etc.!
> On 10 Aug 2016, at 01:24, Allan S Field <allan.field at verizon.net> wrote:
>
> I have a large wet vac and air compressor. I first run the water pump
> as dry as possible. Then I open that valve at the bottom of the hot
> water heater and drain off as much water as will come out through a
> hose run into the bilge. I then remove the water line and check valve
> at the top of the tank, open all the faucets and deck shower, keep the
> hot water tank valve open, and blow out what I can. After that, I use
> a wet vac, hold it over the opening to the hot water tank drain valve,
> cup it with my hand to ensure a fairly tight fit, and let the wet vac
> do its job; that's when I get another gallon or 2 out of the hot water
heater. After that, I again use
> the air compressor and only get a few more drops out.
>
> At a Catalina factory tour several years ago, I remember Gerry Douglas
> saying that virtually all hot water heater failures are due to
> improper winterizing. Once I started using the wet vac to stop using
> the pink stuff, I knew exactly what he meant! I have been doing this
> routine for the last
> 6-7 winters, a few of which have been very cold, and have had zero
problems.
> I also have amortized the cost of the air compressor and wet vac
> already by no longer using the pink stuff.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: C320-list [mailto:c320-list-bounces at lists.catalina320.com] On
> Behalf Of Angus Henderson
> Sent: Tuesday, August 9, 2016 8:04 PM
> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Hot water tank-draining tank
>
> Alan. I am interested in your post in response to Tom's. If opening
> the valve at bottom of hw tank does not drain it, how do you drain for
> winter storage. I have always done it this way possibly mistakenly
> thinking I had drained the tank Angus
> #999
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Aug 9, 2016, at 7:41 PM, Allan S Field <allan.field at verizon.net>
wrote:
>>
>> Tom - Opening the valve at the bottom of the hot water tank does not
>> drain all the water! There is at least 1-2 gallons left. - Allan
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: C320-list [mailto:c320-list-bounces at lists.catalina320.com] On
>> Behalf Of Tom Talling
>> Sent: Tuesday, August 9, 2016 3:45 PM
>> To: c320-list at lists.catalina320.com
>> Subject: [C320-list] Hot water tank
>>
>> When I winterize my boat I disconnect the hot water out line and the
>> cold water in line and connect them together. Then you open up the
>> valve at the bottom of the heater and let all the water run out.
>> Just leave it open for the winter. Then when you run the pink
>> antifreeze through it just goes through the lines and not the tank.
>> Then flush out the lines with fresh water in the spring and no pink
>> fluid in the heater tank. Saves a lot of pink fluid too.
>> Tom Talling
>> One Shot, Bohemia River #978
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: c320-list-request at lists.catalina320.com
>> Sent: Tuesday, August 9, 2016 3:01 PM
>> To: c320-list at lists.catalina320.com
>> Subject: C320-list Digest, Vol 2695, Issue 1
>>
>> Send C320-list mailing list submissions to
>> c320-list at lists.catalina320.com
>>
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>>
>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>> than
>> "Re: Contents of C320-list digest..."
>>
>>
>> Today's Topics:
>>
>> 1. Re: Water Heater Sacrificial Anode (Warren Updike) 2. Lands End
>> (Allan S Field) 3. Re: Lands End (Karl Mielenhausen) 4. Re: C80
>> chart plotter issue (Daryl Hunt) 5. Re: Mid-ship Cleat (sail-ability
>> sail-ability) 6. Re: Mid-ship Cleat (Dick Walker)
>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> -
>>
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2016 17:46:21 -0400
>> From: Warren Updike <wupdike at hotmail.com>
>> To: <C320-List at Catalina320.com>
>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Water Heater Sacrificial Anode
>> Message-ID: <COL129-DS12E16168E68D2FAE3DEB69BE1B0 at phx.gbl>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>
>> Here are two tricks I like to use when closing the boat: 1) open a
>> hot water faucet to let a fair bit of cold water into the hot water
>> tank, this cools the hot water down to retard any growth of biomes
>> that might be present; 2) turn off the water pump and open a faucet
>> to let the water pressure out of the system. Also, we rarely use the
>> AC element to heat water. Once heated by the engine it stays hot for
>> quite a
> while.
>> BTW, when leaving the boat, I also like to run about a bowl-full of
>> potable water through the head. This helps to flush the hoses through
>> to
> the tank.
>> This is especially useful if you use raw water to flush the head.
>> Since switching to only potable water flush and using OdorLos, we've
>> not had a problem with head odors.
>>
>> Warren and Pattie Updike
>> 1994 C320 "Warr de Mar" #62
>> Middle River, Chesapeake Bay
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Dean Vermeire [mailto:dean at vermeire.us]
>> Sent: Monday, August 08, 2016 2:29 PM
>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Water Heater Sacrificial Anode
>>
>> All,
>>
>> Thanks for the feedback. I'm surprised to hear that the sacrificial
>> anode could make it worse.
>>
>> For now, I think I'll give it another good effort of thoroughly
>> cleaning the tanks and water heater and using a new filter. I'll
>> also go back to blowing out / vacuuming out the water system at the
>> end of the
> season.
>>
>> Thanks again,
>> Dean
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: C320-list [mailto:c320-list-bounces at lists.catalina320.com] On
>> Behalf Of Chris Burti
>> Sent: Monday, August 08, 2016 12:14 PM
>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Water Heater Sacrificial Anode
>>
>> In this region, shoreside, sacrificial anodes are blamed for
>> sulphuric smells and removed.
>>
>> Best Regards,
>> Chris Burti
>>
>>
>>> On Aug 8, 2016, at 12:13 PM, Dean Vermeire <dean at vermeire.us> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi All,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> The hot water on our C320 smells bad. I'm not sure I would call it
>>> a sulfur smell, but that wouldn't be too far off. I have flushed
>>> the water tanks, cleaned with a bleach solution, flushed again, etc.
>>> I do think that having put the pink antifreeze in for the winter has
>>> added to the problem. The water at the lake where we keep our boat
>>> is undoubtedly well water, rich with minerals. I do use a filter
>>> cartridge when I fill the tanks, but don't think I'd really want to
>>> drink
>> the water anyway.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I have been reading a bit online, and saw references to a
>>> sacrificial anode for the water heater that sounds like it is what I
need.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Do any of you have experience with this? It looks like it just
>>> replaces the spigot on the water heater with a metal rod.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Any advice is appreciated.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> Dean Vermeire
>>>
>>> Moonstruck II (#847)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 2
>> Date: Mon, 08 Aug 2016 18:00:08 -0400
>> From: "Allan S Field" <allan.field at verizon.net>
>> To: <C320-List at Catalina320.com>
>> Subject: [C320-list] Lands End
>> Message-ID: <000b01d1f1c0$3a8e6380$afab2a80$@verizon.net>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>
>> As a value-add to the membership, we have an arrangement with Lands
>> End for logo clothing. Following is an e-mail I received today from
>> Lands End that may be worth looking into. Note that the Association
>> receives nothing from this offer. To access the 2 available logos,
>> go to <http://ces.landsend.com/Catali1>
>> http://ces.landsend.com/Catali1
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> You are receiving this e-mail with the details a special promotion.
>> We are offering free logo application of logos up to 16,000 stitches
>> and free standard shipping on your orders placed through Friday,
>> August 19th.When placing your order, please call 1-800-497-6566 and
>> mention the promotion code OUT4. This offer may also be used on our
> website. Promotional
>> products do not qualify for this special offer. Thanks again and we
> would
>> love to hear from you!
>>
>>
>>
>> Allan S. Field
>>
>> Secretary/Treasurer
>>
>> Catalina 320 International Association
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 3
>> Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2016 18:29:21 -0400
>> From: Karl Mielenhausen <kmielen at gmail.com>
>> To: C320IA Discussion List <C320-List at catalina320.com>
>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Lands End
>> Message-ID:
>> <CAFoR0_P0u7CS_aU=A0q3+Q8BojAGk=--=Nyo96fAzg=7LzKWgA at mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>>
>> It can be a bear to navigate their website.
>> This link might help...
>> https://business.landsend.com/store/catali1/
>>
>>
>>
>> Karl
>>
>> On Mon, Aug 8, 2016 at 6:00 PM, Allan S Field
>> <allan.field at verizon.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> As a value-add to the membership, we have an arrangement with Lands
>>> End for logo clothing. Following is an e-mail I received today from
>>> Lands End that may be worth looking into. Note that the Association
>>> receives nothing from this offer. To access the 2 available logos,
>>> go to <http://ces.landsend.com/Catali1>
>>> http://ces.landsend.com/Catali1
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> You are receiving this e-mail with the details a special promotion.
>>> We are offering free logo application of logos up to 16,000 stitches
>>> and free standard shipping on your orders placed through Friday,
>>> August 19th.When placing your order, please call 1-800-497-6566 and
>>> mention the promotion code OUT4. This offer may also be used on our
>>> website. Promotional
>>> products do not qualify for this special offer. Thanks again and we
>>> would
>>> love to hear from you!
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Allan S. Field
>>>
>>> Secretary/Treasurer
>>>
>>> Catalina 320 International Association
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 4
>> Date: Mon, 08 Aug 2016 18:44:49 -0400
>> From: Daryl Hunt <drhunt at rochester.rr.com>
>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] C80 chart plotter issue
>> Message-ID:
>> <1aofwt4ap7wf0gq3o5g4ebb9.1470696289043 at email.android.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks Jeff!
>> regards,?Daryl
>>
>> -------- Original message --------
>> From: Jeff Z <jeffzinselmeyer at hotmail.com>
>> Date: 8/6/16 5:01 PM (GMT-05:00)
>> To: c320-list at lists.catalina320.com
>> Subject: [C320-list] C80 chart plotter issue
>>
>> I have the same plotter, and last summer mine started with the
>> distorted display, which then led to complete blank screen. I shipped
>> to Raymarine for diagnosis, expecting the worst. I got a call from
>> the tech there and he said its a common problem, repair was under
>> $200 including return shipping. He also stated they repair it in a
>> way which will prevent the same problem from happening again. I was
>> extremely pleased with the service and how quick i had the unit back.
>> See the raymarine website for shipping instructions.
>> Jeff ZinselmeyerEscape - 934
>>
>> ?? ?
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 5
>> Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2016 11:15:24 -0400 (EDT)
>> From: sail-ability sail-ability <sail-ability at sympatico.ca>
>> To: jbrown5093 <jbrown5093 at yahoo.com>, c320-list
>> <c320-list at catalina320.com>
>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Mid-ship Cleat
>> Message-ID:
>> <319066032.18031.1470755724810.JavaMail.open-xchange at mtlgui01>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>>
>> I got my cleats from Garhauer and they are different lengths for the
>> top and bottom tracks. Garhauer knows this.
>>
>> JohnM
>>
>> 1999#574
>>
>> ---------- Original Message ----------
>> From: jbrown5093 at yahoo.com
>> Date: July 26, 2016 at 4:33 PM
>> I have seen 320s where different track cleats wouldn't fit on the
>> upper track that is recessed. Into the cabin top. The problem isn't
>> with the width of the track but with the length. If just a hair too
>> long you can't get the cleat to slide on because it wont "fit" in
>> the space between the end of the track and the beginning of the
>> recess. My shaffers do fit but another brand (ronstan maybe) won't
>> go on. On another boat even the shaffers wouldn't slip on. So if you
>> plan to use them on both tracks try before you buy.
>> Great tip on stopping the hunting at anchor, Chris. Can't wait to
>> try it.
>> Jim Brown
>> Sent from my iPad
>>>> On Jul 26, 2016, at 3:35 PM, Scott Westwood
>>> <scottwestwood at bellsouth.net> wrote:
>>>
>>> FWIW. I measured my jib track ('98 # 517) a couple of days ago and
>> it was 1-1/4 ".
>>> Leaning even more now to track-run cleats. Still reviewing
>> though..... Would prefer cleat on gunnel ridge under life line but
>> may not be practical (worth the effort).
>>> Thanks,
>>> Scott Westwood scottwestwood at bellsouth.net H (919)-362-8538 C
>> (919)-618-7185
>>>
>>> From: Beverly Wright <bev.wright at verizon.net>
>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>> Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2016 2:50 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Mid-ship Cleat
>>>
>>> I have two track cleats that are different from each other, can't
>> recall the brands, one came from the other owner and I bought one.
>> They are a great choice because they can be removed when racing and
>> cruising (they have caught the lines on occasion) and moved along
>> the track for spring lines when rafting to other boats or at
>> marinas. I had not thought about attaching a 1/4" line to the pin
>> but I'm definitely doing that because it provides something to hold
>> on to when removing them. I almost had one go overboard as it was
>> being removed. I haven't had the issue that Commitment has, but I
>> will keep that trick in mind if we find that happening at anchor.
>>>
>>> My tracks are 1 1/4" per the diagram in the manual
>>>
>>> Bev Wright
>>> s/v Whoosh
>>> Edgewater, MD
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: C320-list [mailto:c320-list-bounces at lists.catalina320.com]
>> On Behalf Of Chris Burti
>>> Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2016 2:05 PM
>>> To: 320
>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Mid-ship Cleat
>>>
>>> I have both (two Garhauer and one Schaefer) and prefer the
>> Schaefer. Adding a loop of 1/4" line to the pin made far more
>> useful. I move it from side to side, forward and aft on the tracks
>> and up and down from the Genoa track to the jib track on the cabin
>> top. This proved farm re effective in setting spring lines at the
>> multitude of docks we experienced on our cruise.
>>>
>>> In addition, Commitment sails like a drunken bat when at anchor in
>> any wind over 5 knots. Using a rolling hitch to tie a spring line
>> from the anchor rode to a mid-ship cleat set well forward moderates
>> that tendency greatly.
>>>
>>> Chris Burti
>>> Farmville, NC
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Tue, Jul 26, 2016 at 12:47 PM, Stephen Cox <scox at timmin.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Don't mount one get the Garhauer that fits on the track
>>>>
>>>> Personally think the Schaefer equivalent is a nicer cleat. It
>> looks
>>>> more in keeping with the other cleats on the boat, has no
>> protrusion
>>>> on top to catch lines either. Defender sell them.
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>>
>>>> Stephen Cox
>>>> Tegwen #1141
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 6
>> Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2016 08:25:07 -0700
>> From: Dick Walker <dickwalker at att.net>
>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Mid-ship Cleat
>> Message-ID: <9E50C1C6-14A2-405B-ADD3-18F9A03D8DB2 at att.net>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>>
>> For the regatta Garhauer is giving a 10% discount, no tax and free
>> shipping
>>
>> Now is the time to buy. Until 12 September
>>
>> Call them and you can quote the c-320 regatta discount
>>
>> This covers anything in their catalogue
>>
>> Call me if you have any questions.
>>
>> Cheers
>>
>>
>>
>> Dick Walker
>> Regatta Chair
>> 740 Olive Ave.
>> Coronado ,CA 92118
>> 619.435.8986
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Aug 9, 2016, at 08:15, sail-ability sail-ability
>>> <sail-ability at sympatico.ca> wrote:
>>>
>>> I got my cleats from Garhauer and they are different lengths for the
>>> top and bottom tracks. Garhauer knows this.
>>>
>>> JohnM
>>>
>>> 1999#574
>>>
>>> ---------- Original Message ----------
>>> From: jbrown5093 at yahoo.com
>>> Date: July 26, 2016 at 4:33 PM
>>> I have seen 320s where different track cleats wouldn't fit on the
>>> upper track that is recessed. Into the cabin top. The problem isn't
>>> with the width of the track but with the length. If just a hair too
>>> long you can't get the cleat to slide on because it wont "fit" in
>>> the space between the end of the track and the beginning of the
>>> recess. My shaffers do fit but another brand (ronstan maybe) won't
>>> go on. On another boat even the shaffers wouldn't slip on. So if you
>>> plan to use them on both tracks try before you buy.
>>> Great tip on stopping the hunting at anchor, Chris. Can't wait to
>>> try it.
>>> Jim Brown
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>>> On Jul 26, 2016, at 3:35 PM, Scott Westwood
>>>> <scottwestwood at bellsouth.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> FWIW. I measured my jib track ('98 # 517) a couple of days ago and
>>> it was 1-1/4 ".
>>>> Leaning even more now to track-run cleats. Still reviewing
>>> though..... Would prefer cleat on gunnel ridge under life line but
>>> may not be practical (worth the effort).
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Scott Westwood scottwestwood at bellsouth.net H (919)-362-8538 C
>>> (919)-618-7185
>>>>
>>>> From: Beverly Wright <bev.wright at verizon.net>
>>>> To: C320-List at Catalina320.com
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2016 2:50 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Mid-ship Cleat
>>>>
>>>> I have two track cleats that are different from each other, can't
>>> recall the brands, one came from the other owner and I bought one.
>>> They are a great choice because they can be removed when racing and
>>> cruising (they have caught the lines on occasion) and moved along
>>> the track for spring lines when rafting to other boats or at
>>> marinas. I had not thought about attaching a 1/4" line to the pin
>>> but I'm definitely doing that because it provides something to hold
>>> on to when removing them. I almost had one go overboard as it was
>>> being removed. I haven't had the issue that Commitment has, but I
>>> will keep that trick in mind if we find that happening at anchor.
>>>>
>>>> My tracks are 1 1/4" per the diagram in the manual
>>>>
>>>> Bev Wright
>>>> s/v Whoosh
>>>> Edgewater, MD
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: C320-list [mailto:c320-list-bounces at lists.catalina320.com]
>>> On Behalf Of Chris Burti
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2016 2:05 PM
>>>> To: 320
>>>> Subject: Re: [C320-list] Mid-ship Cleat
>>>>
>>>> I have both (two Garhauer and one Schaefer) and prefer the
>>> Schaefer. Adding a loop of 1/4" line to the pin made far more
>>> useful. I move it from side to side, forward and aft on the tracks
>>> and up and down from the Genoa track to the jib track on the cabin
>>> top. This proved farm re effective in setting spring lines at the
>>> multitude of docks we experienced on our cruise.
>>>>
>>>> In addition, Commitment sails like a drunken bat when at anchor in
>>> any wind over 5 knots. Using a rolling hitch to tie a spring line
>>> from the anchor rode to a mid-ship cleat set well forward moderates
>>> that tendency greatly.
>>>>
>>>> Chris Burti
>>>> Farmville, NC
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Jul 26, 2016 at 12:47 PM, Stephen Cox <scox at timmin.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Don't mount one get the Garhauer that fits on the track
>>>>>
>>>>> Personally think the Schaefer equivalent is a nicer cleat. It
>>> looks
>>>>> more in keeping with the other cleats on the boat, has no
>>> protrusion
>>>>> on top to catch lines either. Defender sell them.
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>
>>>>> Stephen Cox
>>>>> Tegwen #1141
>>
>>
>>
>> End of C320-list Digest, Vol 2695, Issue 1
>> ******************************************
>
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